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I would love to see a new P38, P4, or P5. The challenge is, would there be a market? Those designs lack the capacity of the CZ-75 and the cult following of the 1911.
I think that there still is a market for the P5. Sig reintroduced the P225 a few years ago, several manufacturers make Lightweight Commanders in 9mm, and Glock finally has a single stack 9mm in the G48.
 

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Steel framed hammer pistols are, simply, obsolete.

I love the 1911. I love the Hi Power even more. FN, simply, has no reason to make a pistol that requires a pistolsmith to finish, and neither does anyone else.

We love our guns, and as a collector I mourn the loss of craftsmanship. I love my PPK, I love my P38. But they are obsolete designs.

Manufacturers can not afford to be sentimental.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

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These kind of questions seems to come up often. The answer is almost aways the same...given finite production capacity and resources they think they can make more money producing something else.

The P38s days as an official police or military sidearm are over. That means it's an enthusiast's gun these days. Can Walther sell enough of them to offset the production time that could of gone into something else? Can they produce them with good enough quality for a good enough price that an enthusiast will buy one over an older version??

Walther seems like a manufacturer with constrained manufacturing capacity. They have to carefully use the capacity they have to maximize profitability -- not that they always get it right.

This is a reason I follow the new PPK/S with interest. They are trying to produce a vintage firearm using modern manufacturing methods and at least some Anerican labor.

If that turns out to be profitable for Walther, perhaps we will see more variations and attempts at reviving the classic Walthers of the past.
 

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I think that there still is a market for the P5. Sig reintroduced the P225 a few years ago, several manufacturers make Lightweight Commanders in 9mm, and Glock finally has a single stack 9mm in the G48.
Glock also has the Glock 43. Think about it. 6 or 7 rounds plus one in the chamber, weighing 20oz loaded... vs the steel P.38 weighing 30oz empty and which is also much larger.

How many could they possibly make, sell, make money on them and keep buyers of it as well as their accounting and their marketing departments happy?
 

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Thats what makes the 1911 so amazing. They can still produce the exact same design and sell it for $500 all day long, and people are more than willing to pay ten times that for a really fancy one.

Some of the really cool old guns like the P38 would be really cost prohibitive to manufacture today.

I really can't even see how they are going to make money on the new PPKs with all that American labor on it. But I hope they do, and I plan to buy one in the not too distant future. Hopefully before they stop making them again. Of course I said that about the Colt Python back in 1976, and I still don't have one. That ship for me sailed long ago, $$$ LOL. I didn't think they would ever stop making the Python. I didn't see the abandonment of revolvers coming, DOH!
 

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The 1911 is just a wonder, and all sorts of folks make them; even the cheap ones work pretty well. It is also the last man standing of the WWII first line service pistols, not to mention WWI.
Not every gun can pull that off.
Moon
 

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I think that there still is a market for the P5. Sig reintroduced the P225 a few years ago, several manufacturers make Lightweight Commanders in 9mm, and Glock finally has a single stack 9mm in the G48.
You have a valid point about the Sig P225a1. I wonder if Walther could produce the P5 at a competitive price.
 

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Steel framed hammer pistols are, simply, obsolete.
I don't think that I can agree with that. Whether steel, aluminum, polymer, hammer fired, or striker fired all handguns do basically the same thing - launch a tiny lead pellet at high velocity. Enthusiasts like us might like to argue about the finer details but for the average consumer we're just splitting hairs.

I wonder if Walther could produce the P5 at a competitive price.
They didn't the first time around. I wonder why Walther Germany couldn't make a profitable all metal pistol but Sig Germany could.
 

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Steel framed hammer pistols are, simply, obsolete.

...
Not when it comes to accurate handguns ... but then most people encountered at the gun range have never even learnt the basics about handgun shooting and will never know the difference. Hammerli had built the carbon fibre model 280 in the 1990s but the most successful match pistols are still built with traditional metal frames to this day.

Last week I shot my favourite Glock, an old G23 with a ported 9mm barrel and Heinie S-8 sights. I play with Glocks and their triggers since almost 30 years now and have this one set up pretty nicely. Afterwards, I shot my Neuhausen SIG P210-6 and the trigger pull is just so much better, that the guns are worlds apart in accuracy and performance.

The CZ SP-01 and CZ's new line of match pistols is refuting any comments that steel framed handguns are obsolete.

 

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Andy makes an excellent point that serious match pistols are all-metal and hammer-fired; CZ 75-series, SIG P210, etc. For carry, not so much, but for the range, all day long.
 

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The 1911 is just a wonder, and all sorts of folks make them; even the cheap ones work pretty well. It is also the last man standing of the WWII first line service pistols, not to mention WWI.
Not every gun can pull that off.
Moon
It is amazing how relevant the 1911 remains over 100 years after it's introduction. Is there another semiauto that comes close to that track record?
 

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I have to agree that steel frame pistols are very accurate, but there are just as accurate, if not more so polymer handguns. STI/SVI series for instance. Although I guess you could argue that the STI/SVI's are steel frame in a sense that they are a mini-steel frame with a polymer grip added to them.
 

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Not when it comes to accurate handguns ... but then most people encountered at the gun range have never even learnt the basics about handgun shooting and will never know the difference. Hammerli had built the carbon fibre model 280 in the 1990s but the most successful match pistols are still built with traditional metal frames to this day.

Last week I shot my favourite Glock, an old G23 with a ported 9mm barrel and Heinie S-8 sights. I play with Glocks and their triggers since almost 30 years now and have this one set up pretty nicely. Afterwards, I shot my Neuhausen SIG P210-6 and the trigger pull is just so much better, that the guns are worlds apart in accuracy and performance.

The CZ SP-01 and CZ's new line of match pistols is refuting any comments that steel framed handguns are obsolete.

Andyd, I think when the comment was made that steel framed handguns were obsolete, the commenter was referring to duty guns of which the P38 was one. At least that's how I took it.

As far as steel framed, hammered fired guns still having a place in the sport or hobbyist world, of course they do.
 

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I carry a steel frame pistol

When I carry my p5c compact with two additional mags, I feel pity for those who only carry polymer guns, or believe they are obsolete. I have 8 other polymer Walthers, each one with a particular advantage, but the all steel compact guns are a breed apart. My other steel compact the P88, is not that compact.
 

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When I carry my p5c compact with two additional mags, I feel pity for those who only carry polymer guns, or believe they are obsolete. I have 8 other polymer Walthers, each one with a particular advantage, but the all steel compact guns are a breed apart. My other steel compact the P88, is not that compact.

Well said. I own one poly gun, the PPQ45.


I don't do compact guns, yet my P88 is a compact, because it is NOT compact. The full size P88 is huge.


I carried my P5Lang in an OWB holster during a BBQ/pool party at my home last month. The get together before that I had the stainless 50AE DEagle in a drop leg holster. I'm the guy with the oddball all metal guns at these events.
 

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My only polymer frame guns, just off the top of my head, would be:

  • P99 AS with threaded barrel
  • P99 AS
  • P99c AS
  • MR9
  • SW99-45
  • CX4 Storm carbine
  • Mustang Lite
  • FNX-9
  • FNX-45
  • MK III 22/45 Hunter
Pretty much everything else is all steel or alloy framed.
 

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Andyd, I think when the comment was made that steel framed handguns were obsolete, the commenter was referring to duty guns of which the P38 was one. At least that's how I took it.

As far as steel framed, hammered fired guns still having a place in the sport or hobbyist world, of course they do.
I interpret "simply obsolete" as an absolute statement that is including all handguns, not just service or carry guns but even if that comment was for duty guns alone, the SIG Sauer P226 and P229 line of handguns can still hold their own against others, despite higher production cost.

While I carry a Glock since decades I am shooting far less common handguns. Steve"s comment about steel framed and hammer fired target pistols nails it: since the inception of the Walther 1936 Olympia model, striker fired target pistols are obsolete:D.
When it comes to performance and elegant lines, the SIG P210 and Hammerli 212 shine.





Isn't the unbroken record of the Hammerli 208 International proof enough?
 

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It is amazing how relevant the 1911 remains over 100 years after it's introduction. Is there another semiauto that comes close to that track record?
The 1911 is even more relevant when you consider the importance of the Browning locking system, it is the most commonly used one in locked breech handguns.
 

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I interpret "simply obsolete" as an absolute statement that is including all handguns, not just service or carry guns but even if that comment was for duty guns alone, the SIG Sauer P226 and P229 line of handguns can still hold their own against others, despite higher production cost.

While I carry a Glock since decades I am shooting far less common handguns. Steve"s comment about steel framed and hammer fired target pistols nails it: since the inception of the Walther 1936 Olympia model, striker fired target pistols are obsolete:D.
When it comes to performance and elegant lines, the SIG P210 and Hammerli 212 shine.





Isn't the unbroken record of the Hammerli 208 International proof enough?
The handguns I own with the best triggers and precision are steel-framed and hammer fired. No argument there.

When I shoot the plastic striker guns, I'm sometimes surprised how good they are for what they are. It seems like they've improved in accuracy and trigger quality since the early days, but still, for precision shooting, the best of the steel-framed hammer guns still have the edge.

When it comes to "duty" guns though, the plastics have taken over. Less weight, easy to maintain, easy to shoot and teach for practical accuracy and very cost effective.

If we take this conversation back to the P38, a reintroduced P38 is highly unlikely to be adopted for official use by any police or militaries. It is not really optimal for any competitions I'm aware of. It would be more of an enthusiast's gun.

I'd love to see it but I doubt it will happen. The time and expense to produce a P38 and do it right probably doom it. I'd like to be wrong on this but probably am not.
 
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