Walther Forums banner

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I just saw a very unusual .22lr P38. It had a four digit serial number which appeared on the slide only. There was no s/n anywhere on the frame. It had an IC (82) or ID (83) date stamp along with an Ulm antler proof stamp. I'll try to get some photos the next time I see it. I did not see any importer markings anywhere. I think it was a GI bring back pistol, but that's just my guess.

Does this sound correct with the s/n only on the slide? I've never seen this before.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Here's one for sale (link here), also with a four-digit serial number.
Yes, I saw it before. This P38 has the s/n is on the frame while the one I saw had it on the slide only. It was on the right rear side of the slide. Other than the Eagle over N, IC/ID, and Ulm proof, the aluminum frame had no other markings. Oh, the pistol had a four digit s/n starting with '4'.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,482 Posts
Does this sound correct with the s/n only on the slide?
No, it doesn't. My P38 .22 has a serialized frame. Even a centerfire frame mated to a conversion kit should still have a serial number.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
No, it doesn't. My P38 .22 has a serialized frame. Even a centerfire frame mated to a conversion kit should still have a serial number.
Yep. I have never seen any P38 frame without a serial number. But here one is. I'll try to get some photos by Monday. This is a strange bird especially when you consider the manufacture date is '82 (IC) or '83 (ID).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
I was finally able to get some pictures. But the owner doesn't want the serial number shown, so that was sanitized. Everything looks kosher on this pistol. I even took some shots of the bare frame looking for funky stuff. It all appears to be factory, but I'm not an expert by any measure.

Here goes:
































 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,472 Posts
As I had pointed out already on RFC, this gun is illegal in its current state and ownership subject to confiscation and penalties. Any gun manufactured after 1968 needs a serial number on the frame or receiver, whichever is the actual firearm by ATF regulations.

It is the importer's responsibility to mark the frame with a number as required by ATF and ensure that the gun fills the sporting requirements, including having a manually operated positive safety. Even an individual that is importing the firearm legally, whether a returning resident or a serviceman, has to comply with the serial number markings but is exempt from importer markings, which only applies to FFL08s but not to FFL01s who do the occasional import.

The safety and a few other features can be built back by an owner, the serialization is a must-have on guns made or imported after 1968.

https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/docs/firearms-imporation-verification-guidebook-policies-procedurespdf/download
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,482 Posts
Any gun manufactured after 1968 needs a serial number on the frame or receiver, whichever is the actual firearm by ATF regulations...the serialization is a must-have on guns made or imported after 1968.
Yes, in the US. But isn't it also a requirement in Germany ? How did the frame get proofed without a serial number ? Or is proofing performed before the serial number is applied ?

Here's my 1968 .22LR P38. I'm pretty sure that it left the factory as a complete pistol and not just a conversion kit :
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,472 Posts
Yes, in the US. But isn't it also a requirement in Germany ? How did the frame get proofed without a serial number ? Or is proofing performed before the serial number is applied ?

Here's my 1968 .22LR P38. I'm pretty sure that it left the factory as a complete pistol and not just a conversion kit :
Walther did not serial number the frames of any Walther GSPs and the factory built dedicated P38s in .22 obviously were not serial numbered on the frames, either. I have seen a few P.38s in Germany with only the four digit serial no. on the slide, none on the frames.

This is a problem for German exporters who do not have marking machines when they want to export a GSP frame alone, they usually cannot get an export license for a major gun part without serial number:D. On importation to the U.S. the importer is usually marking those frames with the number of their slide. If he does not know the original slide serial number, he could accidentally duplicate an existing number unless he makes up a unique and unusual serial number.

P.S.

Proofing is usually done after the serial number is applied and the proof house keeps a record of the numbers. At least they do nowadays in Flensburg.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
I asked the owner about the history of this pistol. He said it originally belonged to a relative who was a retired German police officer. The officer originally moved to Canada upon retirement and then moved to the US a few years later. Sadly, he passed away some time ago.
 
1 - 15 of 15 Posts
Top