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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
This Walther PPK bring back from ww2 doesn't come up when I search it. Photos shows both sides. It was a green cast gold anodized finish commercial model. I have tried for years to find the provenance. The personal photos and letters that were once with this piece have been destroyed including the photo of the veteran sitting in Hitler's car in front of Hitler's house. He had several souvenirs he picked up inside including this PPK. Yeah, I know. You've heard This one before. The finish on the piece was ruined by excessive handling. Nitro proofed only.
 

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Lost, along with everything else at the end of the war.
 

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If this was supposely hitlers ppk, don't you think the grip would have the nazi eagle on it?
I am sure you are hoping it was hitlers so you can make a killing on it's sale but if the person who had it didn't safekeep the photos,like they did to the ppk, might tell you of it's authenticity of being hitlers.
 

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A commercial early model PPK. A really old gun...
 

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I discovered it is 1933. Mow the question is were there records of these special pieces perhaps ordered by individuals?

Few if any factory sale records survived unless taken by the Russians.

It is really green hue gold anodized? On purpose? Well this must be the fourth or fifth "Hitler" Walther pistol to surface, besides the original PP sitting in a collection. And of course there is Hitler's gold plated Menz in the West Point Museum.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
It's greenish hue alright. Doesn't look like plating. Anodized is just my uneducated guess. I suppose it could have been aging or a process. He said he got it from one of the soldiers left in the Berghof. He also picked up a small leather whip with several tails he said was stuck in the umbrella stand. A manufacturer stamp on it, not hand made. He joked that Hitler must have been kinky. He had beautiful glossy prints of him in Hitler's car which he said he drove several days and kept polished up. Unfortunately when he passed they disappeared with letters, maps, etc kept all through the war.
 

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Could we see some pictures from different angels and possibly a different light source?
I see nothing in the first one but gold plating on steel. Can't really decide if its blued steel or bare steel. No indication of anodizing (which by definition is on aluminum)
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I'll see what I can do. It's been passed down to a new generation and not in my hands. Obviously I know nothing of metallurgy. A gold wash maybe? The guy played with it a lot, racking the slide. It was fired frequently. Not a real lightweight. Thanks for the interest. It lives in a safe now and won't be sold. Not pretty, but sure a curiosity.
 

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I would think it is likely gold wash over nickle plate.



Too bad the supporting documents and photos are lost.



Hitler doesn't seem to me to have been a "gun guy" and I don't think I've seen a picture of him wearing a pistol. He had lots of helpers to do any shooting he might require. He was a miserable SOB!
 

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The only pistol i would want that was in his possession is the one he put up to his head and blew his miserable brains out with.
If it could be proven it was the PPK that Hiler used to off himself it would be the most valuable gun in the world.
 
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I would think it is likely gold wash over nickle plate.
Too bad the supporting documents and photos are lost.
Hitler doesn't seem to me to have been a "gun guy" and I don't think I've seen a picture of him wearing a pistol. He had lots of helpers to do any shooting he might require. He was a miserable SOB!
The area not covered with the gold color lacks the shine of the factory nickle used as a base for most of the gold wash Walthers. And the gold seems oddly dull compared to other gold washed Walthers I have seen.

It takes a lot to connect a gun to an image of a soldier sitting in a car with a gun in his hand, even if you had the paper allowing him to bring it home.

Whether Hitler ever carried is often debated. There are images out there, like this one from the Hoffmann photo book of Hitler's visit to the Poland after the Blitzkrieg.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
The claim was he got it in the house from a Nazi. At best I hoped to connect it to some German family who had position. I assume it took some clout to be stationed in the Bergdorf and carry a non issue pistol. Somewhere I read three ss were occupying the building when taken. The damage to the gun was while in the hands of a family drunk who "borrowed" it while the vet was living elsewhere. If it was Hitler's or any one near him I suspect it would have been in the hands of Farley Berman of Anniston Al. I had the pleasure of seeing his collection at his home. Maybe it was a poor process of coloring. That would explain it not being seen often?
 

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The Berman Weapons museum and collocated with the Berman Natural History museum in Anniston are both well worth a 3 -4 hours drive to see. There is some books published by them on their collections as well.


The coloring looks like normal gold plating based on the one picture at the beginning. What isn't normal looking per se is the coloring of the underlying base metal but that could be caused by the poor lighting in the picture.
 

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The claim was he got it in the house from a Nazi. At best I hoped to connect it to some German family who had position. I assume it took some clout to be stationed in the Bergdorf and carry a non issue pistol. Somewhere I read three ss were occupying the building when taken. The damage to the gun was while in the hands of a family drunk who "borrowed" it while the vet was living elsewhere. If it was Hitler's or any one near him I suspect it would have been in the hands of Farley Berman of Anniston Al. I had the pleasure of seeing his collection at his home. Maybe it was a poor process of coloring. That would explain it not being seen often?
Can anyone read the serial number and list it correctly for the record? The image is poor and what I can make out is 789280 or 769280? Frustrating. There are some early engraved/plated guns recorded before 800000, but I don't recall one being "pimped" with gold plating to be carried by an officer or a private individual who qualified under the older more stringent gun law to carry. It obviously wasn't a presentation, unless we are missing something on the other side of the pistol.

From my reading, the Berghof was bombed severely by US forces before being taken by ground troops. The place had been looted by local folks after it had been evacuated. "He got it in the house from a Nazi." Was he in a US unit that occupied the Berghof or any of the other houses in the area? The family can request a DD214 from the records center to ascertain whether that is a fact. Then you can prove that his unit was in the area and perhaps he was. Research is fun. I bought one of the Walther Olympic models in a Walther shooter's case and a Walther double bbl shotgun from a vet's family. Got his DD214 and found he was a mechanic in an MP unit in the 11 Armored. They took Zella-Mehlis.

There were many souvenirs taken from the Berghof. Chairs, tableware, pieces of the building...but no personal items of Hitler that I recall reading about. Those were located in his apartment and taken when Munich was taken. Ray Biley bought a trove of items from a vet who found them in the basement of the Führerbau. Included was the gold plated engraved presentation to Hitler Menz pistol that he donated to the West Point Museum, as well as several items sold on Alexander Auction a few years ago.

I still am not comfortable with the color of the gold finish. Perhaps it is the flash and lack of natural lighting that is changing the color of the gold. But it is far different IMO from the gold finish of this exceptional presenatation Walther PP that was produced 1930.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
789220. I've seen the gun in all kinds of light. Always the strange hue of green. I will look for his DD214. There was no photo shop on the pictures I saw in the 1950's. I I hope to find out from the vast knowledge here on this forum if the piece was kosher for the time as to color and possible source. I'll ask the boys if they care to take it further for testing. Right now it's an old fella's curiosity from a post war childhood being revisited. Thanks.
 

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789220. I've seen the gun in all kinds of light. Always the strange hue of green. I will look for his DD214. There was no photo shop on the pictures I saw in the 1950's. I I hope to find out from the vast knowledge here on this forum if the piece was kosher for the time as to color and possible source. I'll ask the boys if they care to take it further for testing. Right now it's an old fella's curiosity from a post war childhood being revisited. Thanks.

Thank you very much for the serial number. I am not accusing anyone of faking photographs. You saw what you saw sixty years ago. And you were told what it was. Whether it was a mercedes in front of the remains of the Berghof, or perhaps another destroyed building on the Obersalzburg, we will never know. From my experience with gold washed/plated pistols of the period, I would say from the photo that the finish on the gun is not correct. Moreover, I think it highly unusual to find a gold finished Walther PPK with no other attributes of presentation or additional engraving. The gun was produced in 1932 and alleged captured thirteen years later. There are no factory records recording the sale of all Walther PPs and PPKs. There are odd sale orders or letters confirming specific pistols that have surfaced over the years. So I would judge it very unlikely to be able to connect this pistol to a single person who might have been a visitor to or stationed at the Berghof at the end of the war.


I would like to see better quality focused photos of this PPK showing both sides and perhaps the magazine if the owners would consent. You might suggest to them to wipe the pistol down, as there seems to be dirt or corrosion at edge of the grip and frame. It may have moved onto the grip too.
 
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So many PPKs were plated after being brought back with GI’s post war, I would be real cautious about this pistol. If that is just a gold wash over bare steel ...
 
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