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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I was checking fit of my Fobus holster this morning when I saw some funky-looking crud on the plastic grips of my pistol. Closer inspection revealed a jagged crack on the right grip from the mounting screw to the top of the grip. On the left side there was a smaller crack from below the screw to the bottom of the grip. A third crack formed an inverted "Y" with the second crack and wrapped around to the back of the grip and down to the base of the grip. I took the grips off and it appears that the plastic may have been weakend from the oil/solvent I use to clean the gun. I use Hoppe's #9 to clean with and Tetra gun grease and gun lube to lubricate with. There was a lot of black on the little bit of fluid I found under the grips which may have been the plastic being eaten away. This is the first time I have had something like this on ANY gun. I've been using Hoppe's #9 since back in the late 60s to clean both plastic and metal with no ill effect. If you own a S&W PPK you might want to take a close look at your grips around the screw area.
I dunno if Smith is using some cheap plastic in the grips that reacts with Hoppe's or what. I sure never had this problem with S&W plastic grips on their own guns. For me...I'm going to start searching for WOOD grips for my PPK. Anyone who knows where I can get a nice set of wood grips for the S&W PPK please feel free to post here.

Dep



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Sorry to hear that, Dep, though I wonder if Hoppe's is the culprit. I use it regularly on my S&W PPK/S with no ill effects at all (and just took a close look at the grips before I posted this). I'm hard-pressed to give you an alternative ... unless the grips themselves came from a bad batch of plastic or perhaps were exposed to some other element somewhere along the line. That's most strange, indeed -- a real mystery.

Didn't David the Gnome post pictures of his PPK with rosewood grips recently? As I recall, they looked stunning. He might weigh in again on where he got them.
 

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WOW!!!

I've used Hoppe's on my guns since forever, including my PPK. I am sure over the years the PPK grips got a Hoppe's wipe-down on ocassion, not to mention regular gun oil and break free, all with no ill-effects.

I would let S&W know about the problem for sure.

For replacements, Eagle is good. They can only supply rosewood, given the open backstrap of the PPK, rosewood may not be strong enough.

I would bet Hogue supplies the better made grips and in an assortment of woods. All of the replacements are going to be thicker than the original plastic. Other than these two makers, I don't think anyone else out there is making PPK grips except for Nill.

I would suggest an older set of the brown grips from the German pistols, but I think S&W made alot of dimensional changes with their version and doubt they would fit.

Murphy is an insidious Ba*t*rd!!!!
 

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Deputy,

I've read in a product test, that Tetra Gun contains ammonia and should be used very carefully. If you don't completely remove it from your gun after cleaning, it evaporates after a while and, under certain conditions, may cause the destruction of the metal parts including the barrel and the blue finish. Don't know if it even eats up plastic grips ...

I always read the list of ingredients and if it contains ammonia I keep my fingers away from it. Seems to be very agressive.

regards,
inspiron
 

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Here are some solvent products out of the test which I think are available in the US. 'yes' means it contains ammonia.

Robla Solo Mil - yes
Hoppe?s No. 9 - no
Hoppe?s Benchrest - yes
Tetra Gun Copper Solvent - yes
Liqui Moli Guntec - yes

regards,
inspiron
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Here are some solvent products out of the test which I think are available in the US. 'yes' means it contains ammonia.

Robla Solo Mil - yes
Hoppe?s No. 9 - no
Hoppe?s Benchrest - yes
Tetra Gun Copper Solvent - yes
Liqui Moli Guntec - yes

regards,
inspiron
Actually, Hoppe's #9 DOES contain ammonia. And I don't use Tetra Copper solvent. Never had a problem with Tetra before.

Here's a question I asked Hoppe's about ammonia a while ago back on the CMP forum concerning using Hoppe's to clean corrosive ammo. Their reply:


"Hoppes #9 is ammonia based, but it is PH balanced so that it will not harm the weapon. Unfortunately we are not allowed to know what exact ingredients are in the Hoppes, but there are specific ingredients that remove those salts. And of course you will not see a great removal like you will when you let the gun soak with the #9. I would suggest a boresnake dipped in the #9 while you are out shooting. That is a great field cleaning technique to quickly remove those corrosive salts."



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Discussion Starter #9

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Discussion Starter #10
WOW!!!

I've used Hoppe's on my guns since forever, including my PPK. I am sure over the years the PPK grips got a Hoppe's wipe-down on ocassion, not to mention regular gun oil and break free, all with no ill-effects.

I would let S&W know about the problem for sure.

For replacements, Eagle is good. They can only supply rosewood, given the open backstrap of the PPK, rosewood may not be strong enough.

I would bet Hogue supplies the better made grips and in an assortment of woods. All of the replacements are going to be thicker than the original plastic. Other than these two makers, I don't think anyone else out there is making PPK grips except for Nill.

I would suggest an older set of the brown grips from the German pistols, but I think S&W made alot of dimensional changes with their version and doubt they would fit.

Murphy is an insidious Ba*t*rd!!!!
The question is does Eagle grips make them for the S&W PPK? The S&W grip is totally different from the other PPK grips. The S&W PPK does NOT have an open backstrap. It is a complete wraparound grip. I looked at the Nill website but could not find a S&W PPK grip there either.



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I checked the Hogue website and they have lots of PPK grips, but they were all shown on Interarms vintage pistols. The Hogue grips are two piece of the "wraparound" style of the PPK.

I think Hogue has the better product, and a variety of woods - like Goncalo Alves, which is pretty hard. I have had alot of Eagle Grips over the years and find the Rosewood they use very dark and oily.

I did not check the Eagle website, or Hogue in any detail - you may have to check directly with them to see if the S&W PPK will work with either outfits grips.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I checked the Hogue website and they have lots of PPK grips, but they were all shown on Interarms vintage pistols. The Hogue grips are two piece of the "wraparound" style of the PPK.

I think Hogue has the better product, and a variety of woods - like Goncalo Alves, which is pretty hard. I have had alot of Eagle Grips over the years and find the Rosewood they use very dark and oily.

I did not check the Eagle website, or Hogue in any detail - you may have to check directly with them to see if the S&W PPK will work with either outfits grips.
Yep...calling Eagle and S&W tomorrow about grips.



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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
Just got off the phone with Eagle Grips and S&W. I ordered the Eagle Smooth Ebony grips for $79.95. They DO have them for the S&W PPK. :D Unfortunately, they are on backorder and I won't receive them until next month. Not a big deal, though. At least I can get them.

Then I called S&W/Walther customer service and described what happened. They had no explaination concerning the cracks. But for the "eating away" the guy immediately said it was caused by the Hoppe's #9. I told him I'd been using that stuff all my life and never had this happen before. But he said it was definitely the Hoppe's. "The grips are made of polymer and Hoppe's will eat at them" were his exact words. I am thinking the grips are made out of cheap polymer, inferior to what was installed on the Interarms guns, and that's why the Hoppe's eats at them. I've had Hoppe's get on all kinds of plastic gun parts and never had this happen before. At any rate, S&W is sending me out a free set of grips for the PPK...which is cool.
But I will install the Eagle wood grips as soon as I get them.
So everyone who has S&W Walther pocket pistols beware...if you use Hoppe's or any other gun cleaner, better not get that stuff on the plastic grips. :eek:

Dep



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Dep: Glad to hear that S&W stepped up, which is no surprise: Their customer service is likely the very best in the gun industry. At the same time, you have to wonder about the wisdom of laying the whole thing at the doorstep of Hoppe's No. 9. Like you, I've used it for years with nary a problem -- and I'll wager that most folks on this forum and thousands more besides would step up and say the same thing. It might have been the convenient thing from the S&W customer service rep to lay the blame on Hoppe's, but there's a strong body of evidence to contradict that assessment. To be sure, I'm going to be more watchful when using the stuff, but I don't think that I'll stop using it. Hoppe's a great product and has been for decades.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
451: Agree with you completely. One SHOULDN'T have to remove the plastic grips to clean a pistol with Hoppe's. I think the "polymer" compound in the S&W PPK grips is screwed up and that is the problem. I know one of the main ingredients of Hoppe's is kerosene. But that is hardly caustic to plastic. My kerosene containers for my space heaters are blue plastic. Ammonia is probably caustic to plastic, but Hoppe's uses a PH balanced formula that (according to them) isn't caustic. And I know of some other gun cleaners that are a LOT more caustic than Hoppe's. I dunno...it just doesn't wash with me either to blame Hoppe's for this problem. :mad:
Oh yeah....two other things...
#1 I just bought a small container of Hoppe's #9 for my cleaning case. The container is made out of PLASTIC.
#2 Hoppe's now makes an ammonia-free gun cleaner. It's called Hoppe's Elite.

"After an in-depth study of weapon care technology, Hoppe's Elite, an ammonia-free, odorless, non-toxic, biodegradable and non-flammable line, was formulated. This technology outperformed traditional hazardous products, cutting cleaning time by 80 percent. The latest addition to the line, Copper Terminator, removes copper four times faster than ammonia-based products. This is good news for retailers, as they are realizing the benefits of stocking a green line, while at the same time giving consumers better products -— a positive sign for creating a sustainable industry."

http://www.golfbusinesswire.com/shooting_wire_release.html?releaseID=116500



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Sorry for coming up with this topic again, but here is what I've
learned from the solvent test report mentioned above.

Hoppe's and other solvents are PH balanced as of their mixture
of ingredients - that's correct. But when leaving the product on the
gun for longer time, some of the ingredients evaporates, while
other don't. The remaining ingredients now, which are some kinds of chemical salt,
are no longer balanced and interacting with metal parts, plastic and so on.
The authors of the solvent product test recommend to thoroughly
clean the gun from the remains and use a common gun oil to
preserve the weapon.

regards,
inspiron
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Inspiron: I did not "coat" the gun with Hoppe's #9. I used a small damp spot of it on a rag to clean off powder residue from the metal parts, and then I wiped it off and gave a light coat of Tetra gunoil over the metal parts. I MAY have got some on the plastic when I was cleaning the slide, but it would have been a very small amount. I suspect ALL gun solvents have some kind of aggesssive chemicals or they wouldn't be able to remove burnt power and lead and other fouling. I am an old geezer and have been using Hoppe's #9 on my firearms since I started shooting them...that would be 1967 when I joined the US Army. Do the math. 40 years with NO ill effects from Hoope's #9. Now I suddenly have grips decompose from it's use? I don't think it's Hoppe's. I think it is some cheap plastic formula in the S&W grips that is the culprit. Note also what I mentioned above...Hoppe's now sells their #9 cleaner in PLASTIC BOTTLES. That pretty much confirms to me that it's harmless to most plastic with the exception of the stuff the new PPK grips are made of.

Dep



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Discussion Starter #18
Well here's an update on my grip situation. I received my replacement grips from S&W in the mail today. Pretty fast service. Unfortunately, pretty incompetent service. When I opened the package up I found PPK/S grips :mad: This is the second time I have dealt with incompetence in ordering parts from S&W. I think they have a bunch of morons working the phone lines. I REPEATEDLY asked for wraparound S&W PPK grips because I knew they were different from the PPK/S grips. ACK!!!! From the looks of things I may get my Eagle grips BEFORE I get the correct S&W grips. Sure glad I ordered BOTH. :rolleyes:

Dep



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Dep,

Next time you call S&W make sure you ask the FULL name of the person you are talking to in the service department!!

You have odviously been talking to "Murphy"!

;)
 

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