[Heavy Handed]

Does anyone know where I can find instructions for a full detail strip of S&W mfg'd PPK? I know there are some differences between older models and the Smith ones. I've come to the conclusion that Smith didn't do a very good job of deburring etc and would like to clean up all of the bearing surfaces I can get at. As usual, any help greatly appreciated.

 

[MGMike]

If you leave it alone you can't hurt anything.

M

 

[Heavy Handed]

If I leave it alone it'll wind up someone else's headache. A carry pistol that doesn't go bang when the trigger is squeezed is a paperweight.

 

[searcher451]

If I leave it alone it'll wind up someone else's headache. A carry pistol that doesn't go bang when the trigger is squeezed is a paperweight.

HH: Not wanting to leave another gunowner with a headache is admirable. You might get what you need from this site; it breaks down a wide variety of guns, including several Walther models -- the PPK among them:

http://www.gunsworld.com/exploded_us.htm

Good luck.

 

[TNwaltherman]

Actually, the S&W PPK is put together exactly the same as the originals. The differences are minor. Compared to my older ones, the Smith seems to have an extra hammer strut thingy that's actually part of the hammer assembly. Then, of course, there's that beaver tail protuberance... There are some decent detail stripping instructions in a book titled:
KNOW YOUR WALTHER PP & PPK PISTOLS by E.J. Hoffschmidt
be careful and use common sense. The part about compressing the extracter spring can result in a gouged pistol if you use a steel screwdriver or awl as the author suggests. Use a brass tool! Oh yeah, to get the trigger guard, trigger guard plunger and spring, and trigger guard pin back together, you will need all THREE of your hands, a strong friend, and some VERY imaginative language... I think I'd leave this part alone

 

[banddr2]

I am all for detailing your pistol and learning how all works. But there is one area that you cannot do without special tools (I found out the hard way) and that is the cocking peice. It is held in by two press fitted pins, if you drive them out you may not get them to stay back in. It is best just to leave the cocking peice in the frame, everything else is safe to remove. Also never attempt to remove any metal from the safety lever, if you screw that up your safety and hammer drop will not work properly (also found out the hard way) and those come in many different sizes and I had a hell of a time finding the right size to make it work again.

 

[TNwaltherman]

Oops! I completely forgot about the cocking piece. Yeah, I left mine alone because I wasn't sure how it came out.

 

[MGMike]

If I leave it alone it'll wind up someone else's headache. A carry pistol that doesn't go bang when the trigger is squeezed is a paperweight.

Then sell it and let somebody else (who has the knoweldge, tools and experience) deal with it. Buy something else that does go bang, and suits you.

M

 

[Deputy]

This rarely happens, but I gotta agree with MGMike on this one. The PPK is not a 1911A1. It does NOT lend itself to detail stripping at all. If there is a problem with it not going bang every time you pull the trigger, then send it back to S&W for a lookover. If there is a specific part you want to change for better performance, then MAYBE doing it yourself is okay, after thorough investigation of what exactly is involved in replacing it. I also was looking for a manual that gave detailed field stripping of the PPK when I first bought mine because I was contemplating installing a reduced power trigger spring. But after going to the range I discovered the trigger pull wasn't bad at all. And there are many "tricks", like the ones mentioned above, that you need to know BEFORE stripping.

TNwaltherman: I'm sure glad I have that beavertail protuberance. It makes shooting a box of 50 a joy instead of torture

Dep



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[Heavy Handed]

Thanks to all for the feedback. Using the Hipocratic Oath as my guide (first do no harm), gave her a once over. Did not remove the cocking piece. The flat on the hammer spring guide that returns the hammer to an upright orientation looked malformed to me. I cleaned it up with a fine stone and rounded it off a tiny bit. Did not remove the trigger guard or mag release.

200rds DA only and not a single failure to prime. Did have 3 instances where a round started to chamber but failed to fully seat. I suspect my grip was getting a little loose between rapidly working the de-cocker, and having put 450rds through it in the the last six days. My hand is starting to get a bit tender.

I'm going to keep careful track of those FTF's. If anyone knows of a reason for them other than my grip weakening, let me know. I'm making this my new carry gun and welcome any input toward improving its performance.

P.S. Even in DA this thing is scary accurate!

 

[TNwaltherman]

Dep, I forget to take into account my hand size. I don't have girly hands (like I would admit if I did) but they aren't catcher's mits either. I've just never had a problem with hammer or slide bite with a PPK or 1911. I guess I'm just lucky and forget that everyone isn't the same as me. Before S&W put the extension on there, I think this was a popular gunsmith addition, so I guess there was a real need for it. Since I never needed this, I think it just makes a graceful classic profile look out of proportion. Sorry... I guess I should keep my big mouth shut! A guy could get whooped that way... kinda' like insulting a buddy's prom date isn't it?

 

[Deputy]

TNwaltherman: LOL...you're right. I have NEVER seen anyone admit to having "girly hands". I suspect mine are about average. My glove size is 9. That works out to Medium. Maybe we should base hand size on that?
For gloves you wrap a tape measure just below the knuckles.

http://www.leatherglovesonline.com/pages2/sizes.htm

I guess some guys have "gorilla hands". Not me
The beavertail probably brought a lot of guys back to the PPK who had previously had hammer/slide bite. I never had a problem with it either on any gun. I'll grant you the LOOKS of the pre S&W PPK is certainly a lot nicer. But I like that S&W made other mods like a better feed ramp to make it more HP-friendly.

Heavy Handed: I also had a couple of instances where the slide failed to seat completely. This may just be the sign of a new gun needing breaking in. Also, I like to use a tiny amount of RIG +P gun grease on the slide rails. Not a ton of it, but just a smidgeon to ease the metal-on-metal friction. At least during initial break-in. I also use a small amount of grease on all my slide rails on all my autos before going to the range. It has really cut down on malfunctions since I started doing so.

Dep



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[MGMike]

The flat on the hammer spring guide that returns the hammer to an upright orientation looked malformed to me. I cleaned it up with a fine stone and rounded it off a tiny bit.

If you've altered the hammer spring guide, better check to make certain that the hammer rebound function still works positively.

Thee spring guide has two bearing surfaces on the hammer, and the shape and fit of both are critical. The upper one is a concave semicircle that mates with the circumference of the hammer pin; poor fit ruins the DA pull. The lower bearing surface is is not flat but dome-shaped and rests under the heel of the hammer shoe; it controls hammer rebound. The distance between the two bearing surfaces of the spring guide must be fitted to match the corresponding seats on the hammer. Hammers vary a great deal, so selective fitting is sometimes easiest.

If rebound is lame or nonfunctional, safety is compromised. The hammer block may not recover after de-cocking when the safety lever is flicked off. In that mode impact on the hammer can fire a chambered cartridge.

M

 

[Heavy Handed]

If you've altered the hammer spring guide, better check to make certain that the hammer rebound function still works positively.

Thee spring guide has two bearing surfaces on the hammer, and the shape and fit of both are critical. The upper one is a concave semicircle that mates with the circumference of the hammer pin; poor fit ruins the DA pull. The lower bearing surface is is not flat but dome-shaped and rests under the heel of the hammer shoe; it controls hammer rebound. The distance between the two bearing surfaces of the spring guide must be fitted to match the corresponding seats on the hammer. Hammers vary a great deal, so selective fitting is sometimes easiest.

If rebound is lame or nonfunctional, safety is compromised. The hammer block may not recover after de-cocking when the safety lever is flicked off. In that mode impact on the hammer can fire a chambered cartridge.

M

Thanks for pointing out the correct shape of the lower bearing surface. On mine it was concave-it actually had nearly the same profile as the upper one. I didn't quite make it dome shaped, but i did "flatten" it out and round off the tip. Also, I checked it for function every couple of strokes to make sure the hammer block was working right. I also made some small witness marks on the side of the hammer relative to the slide. Unlike my nickname, I'm pretty methodical when dealing with something like a firearm. I don't like paying for parts just to get back to zero.

 

[MGMike]

I have no knowledge about how S&W fits the lower bearing of the hammer spring guide--or even if they bother to fit it at all. You'd have to see their drawings to tell. On German and Interarms guns, that bearing should be dome-shaped and in contact with the hammer shoe when the upper concave bearing is in concentric contact with the hammer pin. When hammer rebound is sluggish it may be improved by stoning the inside of the ledge (not its tip) to accentuate the dome-- which provides more clearance for the hammer to rock back.

M

 

[Heavy Handed]

The rebound seemed to be fine. I was looking for anything that might be retarding the forward progress of the hammer once it is thrown clear of the upper bearing surface.

 

[banddr2]

On your ftf, check the extractor claw, I once had an interarms ppk that i had to keep that sucker clean, or it would slow down the case rim when it tries to slide under it while returning to battery, thus hanging the slide movement up just enough to keep it from going fully into battery. It may not be your problem, just an idea. Could also try a new or stronger hammer and recoil spring, but the hammer spring will increase your DA pull. Wolffe Gun Springs make packs of various springs for pretty cheap and you can try them and tune the gun better if it is finicky.

 

[Deputy]

One other thing...these guns all have smaller parts and are probably more "crud sensitive" than say a 1911. I wouldn't go more than 50 rounds between thorough cleanings. Especially if the insides are crudding up with powder and look black.



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[ispeed]

I would tend to agree with Dep on the cleanings. I haven't fired many (maybe 200) rounds through my S&W PPK/S, but I have noticed that with WWB it tends to get pretty dirty. This past weekend, I bought the wallyworld special of 100 rounds and shot all 100 with 1 magazine of Corbon JHP and 1 magazine of Remington Golden Sabers JHP so a total of 114 shots fired. I shot the JHP's first then the 100 FMJ's. On round 97 (total) the gun failed to cock on the hammer on the 5 round in the magazine. Not a real problem, just had a DA pull on the next shot but no failure to eject. On round 112 total the gun did the same thing. Once again ejection was fine, but had a DA hard pull on the final 2 rounds. Not a big deal, but that was it for the day. No more ammo. When I got home to clean the gun was filthy. I suspect that's where the problem entered. I have not shot the gun again, but I do not think this will be a future issue. I could possibly benefit from grease on the rails as Dep has suggested in many threads, but my local gun shop does not carry much in cleaning and maint supplies and I have just been too lazy to order online.

 

[Deputy]

Ispeed: RIG +P is available from Midway online.

http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=254771&t=11082005

If you are old enough to remember the Brylcreme commercial..."a little dab will do ya"
And I do man a LITTLE dab. Just enough so there's a thin film of it.



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