[B52flyer]

Gentlemen - my first time here. Am shopping for a CCW 9mm and have narrowed choices to the Kahr MK9 (yes, I know it's "heavy" but it's lighter than the S&W Model 66 2.5 in I'm carrying now!), the Glock 26 and the new PPS. I'm concerned about the "help, my slide has locked rearward and it won't budge" syndrome on the PPS. Here's my question: anyone have any idea how many PPS owners this has affected? One of two? One out of a thousand? Just wondering....

Thanks.

B52flyer sends.

B52: Keeping America free for over fifty years.....

 

[InfernoMDM]

Ok here are some thoughts.

1. All pistols including the glock go through issues. The glock had a frame break issue and they added a extra pin to strength the frame. However you can still find the old 2 pin glocks on the market and still firing.

2. It should be a concern, but we as a forum are going to see these issues alot more. You don't really come here with springfield XD issues.

3. Although it has happened it isn't happening yet on a regular basis. Lets see what happens, and hope for the best. Hopefully its just a minor issue/accident in placement of parts that cause the issue.

 

[WaltherPPS]

So far in the posts about the slide lock up problems, no one has said what type of ammo they were using. +p or +p+ type or standard 9mm. The +p has much higher pressures and may be some of the culprit. If there ends up being a serious issue and it is a small part failure or repeat malfunction, then I am sure the manufacturer will address this and remedy it.

 

[PhilR.]

Just wanted to post a few thoughts.....

G26 vs. PPS: I have more Walthers than any other brand, so obviously I have nothing against them. I also have a G26 too. My 26 has proven to be a fantastic, accurate pistol. It's been 100% reliable for close to 2k rounds, and has fed and fired everything I've thrown at it. Despite all that, I'm always interested in the next "best" thing. I looked at a PPS, and was somewhat disappointed. It's as long and tall as a G26, but not as thick. IMO what you loose in capacity is not worth the slight edge in thinness.

If you need something soon, then I would say to get the Glock because it has been around for a while, and has a great track record. Perhaps the PPS will have the same track record one day, but it hasn't been around long enough to establish a record - good or bad. The Glock doesn't have any real "issues" at the moment, so why go with a pistol that may very well have them?

Kahr MK9: I don't have one, but a good friend does. It has also proven to be a 100% shooter over many thousands of rounds. It also has the best trigger of any striker-fired pistol I've ever used - by a long shot (yes, pun intended). In my hands it's not as accurate as my Glock, but that is probably because I haven't used it nearly as much. I will say that if I had shot the MK before I purchased my Glock, I wouldn't have a Glock right now.

I don't consider the MK9 to be light enough to pocket carry, but if size is more of a concern than weight, then an MK would be well worth the time to investigate. The only 9mm that I can think of that is smaller is the Rohrbaugh.

PhilR.

 

[dmobrien2001]

The only 9mm that I can think of that is smaller is the Rohrbaugh.

Nice piece. BTDT. End result: Rohrbaugh bought mine back. Wasn't realiable in my hands and I'm no newbie. I should have kept the PM9 it replaced as it was 100%.

I'm leaning toward the PPS, but am also following the Kel-Tec PF9. My son has one and pocket carries it. In jeans no less. His has been back to Kel-Tec once with a broken ejector. His had an early design, non-replaceable, so they replaced the frame. Ever since his has been 100%.

Glock is missing out on the small frame, single stack nine market place. There is demand. People will buy. I'm one of them.

 

[PX15]

JMOFO:

Regarding the slide lock problem some folks have been having on the early PPS pistols.

I expect any new product to have the potential for "bugs" and it may well be this slide lock problem will turn out to be a "bug" for the PPS. But I do know that before the pistol was released for sale on the retail market it has undergone tremendous testing and apparently this problem never surfaced before in testing.

Perhaps just a bad batch of slide lock release springs?

Don't know, but I'm going to buy a black PPS as soon as my local dealer can find me one, and if it has a slide lock issue I'll just let the fine S&W warranty folks send me a free "return label", I'll ship it to them free, and they'll fix the problem.

Chances are by the time I get my PPS the issue will be resolved. Either way I want one.

As to buying a Glock 26 instead of a PPS. Respectfully, and no offense to PhilR intended but if you are considering going that route I would suggest you consider the Walther P99c/AS.

I had two Glock 26's in years past and FOR ME the grip was like a brick, the accuracy was not up to par with my Sig P239 which until I later purchased my Walther P99c/AS was my "yardstick for accuracy"... My Walther P99c/AS right out of the box outshot the Sig P239.

My experience has been that the Walther P99c/AS has many details that set it apart from the Glock26 and is, for my needs, a much better choice.

You might chose to wait a while on the PPS purchase as no doubt any bugs will be found and "de-bugged" in later series PPS's.. I want one as soon as I can get it.

Again, no offense intended regarding my personal opinion on the Glock26/Walther P99c/AS comparison issue.

Best Wishes,

J.Pomeroy

 

[czydj]

I have inbetween 500 and 1000 rounds through my PPS, using about 10-20% +P ammo, and it's been fine. Tight groups, good double-tap pairs and very easy shooting.

 

[MGMike]

JMOFO:

... But I do know that before the pistol was released for sale on the retail market it has undergone tremendous testing and apparently this problem never surfaced before in testing.

I don't wish to be contentious, but how do you know that?

M

 

[PX15]

I don't wish to be contentious, but how do you know that?
M

MGMIKE:

I believe if you care to research the issue you will find out that the German Gov't requires any firearm considered for use by it's LEO's/Military/ect. be SEVERELY tested before it is acceptable for use.

I would suggest that saying the PPS had undergone "tremendous testing" would be a reasonable assumption, wouldn't you?

I would also suggest that if a "slide lock" issue (or any other) had surfaced during that testing that problem would have been rectified by Walther before it was even brought before the German Government to be considered for acceptance.

Walther has been producing quality firearms for over a century. As far as I know the only two Walther marked pistols that have had less than excellent reputations are the PPK and the P22.

The PPK has a reputation for being ammo sensitive, heavy trigger, slide bite. the PP has a reputation as being a firearm that simply is not up to the standards expected of a Walther bannered product, altho I have read where the newer P22's are better.

It is MY opinion that although it seems Walther is indeed "brain dead" when it comes to marketing it's firearms on the American market I do not think for one second that Walther of Germany has released the PPS knowing it has a slide lock issue.. Just didn't happen.

I say a bad batch of slide lock release springs, but I'm just guessing. Whatever the problem it WILL be fixed, free, and that works for me.

I would be willing to wager that a firearm accepted for use by the German Government undergoes at LEAST as must testing as one that is acceptable to the US Government, and I respectfully suggest probably a lot more.

Just my old fart opinion, YMMV.

Best Wishes,

J. Pomeroy

 

[InfernoMDM]

PhilR. The glock has a long track record of reliablity after a bunch of issues as well. Your G26 had lots of issues in the first gen that everyone seems to ignore forget about.

Also I like the p99c and mine has 10K at least probably a good deal moore through it.

 

[MGMike]

MGMIKE:

"I believe if you care to research the issue you will find out that the German Gov't requires any firearm considered for use by it's LEO's/Military/ect. be SEVERELY tested before it is acceptable for use."

Since I'm an old fart too, let me be, for the moment, a skeptic. Since you have already researched this issue to know what it is that I would find, perhaps you could direct me to the official reference wherein I can read the test requirements and criteria, and the results of the German government's testing and blessing of the PPS.

"I would suggest that saying the PPS had undergone "tremendous testing" would be a reasonable assumption, wouldn't you?"

I would say that it is an assumption, not an established fact. Whether the assumption is reasonable depends on what one would find from researching the first point.

M

 

[MGMike]

Sorry for the confusion in my previous post. The source of the quotes got garbled; they are from PX1's post above.

M

 

[PhilR.]

PhilR. The glock has a long track record of reliablity after a bunch of issues as well. Your G26 had lots of issues in the first gen that everyone seems to ignore forget about.

Probably the main reason why it took me so long to buy a Glock.

I would imagine that most new pistol designs will encounter teething problems, and Glock and Walther are no different. That's why I say if someone is worried about reliability now, then either wait until issues have been cleared, or get something whose issues have already been cleared.

I doubt that everyone has forgotten or ignored the 1st gen. issues - it's just that the issues have been fixed, and subsequent generations have little to talk about.

PhilR.

 

[PhilR.]

Nice piece. BTDT. End result: Rohrbaugh bought mine back. Wasn't realiable in my hands and I'm no newbie. I should have kept the PM9 it replaced as it was 100%.

Glock is missing out on the small frame, single stack nine market place. There is demand. People will buy. I'm one of them.

I had read more than one post about the Rohrbaugh's reliability, and that is why I decided not to get one. Went with a PM9 too, which I still have. If I didn't already have the G26, I would have gotten an MK9. I will keep your post in mind if I ever decide to sell the Kahr.

I would also stand in line for a small-frame Glock, but we will never see one. The import restrictions will not allow it. That is the reason why the PPS is so large. If Walther could have sold a PPS that was the size of a PM9, I would be all over it....

PhilR.

 

[PhilR.]

As to buying a Glock 26 instead of a PPS. Respectfully, and no offense to PhilR intended but if you are considering going that route I would suggest you consider the Walther P99c/AS.

Why would I be offended? I love Walthers! If the OP had asked about the P99c, I would have addressed it, but I was just trying to address his particular concerns (which didn't include the P99c), and not add something that he didn't ask for.

If I could have found a P99c within a days drive, I wouldn't have purchased the G26 (not that I'm unhappy with the G, it's been a fantastic pistol), but the G was in stock at my favorite GS, and I got a decent deal on it. Besides, I already had a regular P99, but I never had a Glock, so I decided it was time to see what the hubbub was all about.....

PhilR.

 

[PX15]

FWIW:

Before I purchased my first P99/AS I did research on the Walther P99 pistol.. I used the "Google" function", and even tho you are an old fart, such as myself, I suggest you might consider doing the same for the PPS.

I was able to find sufficient information explaining the development and testing of the P99 to resolve any questions I might have had as to the quality and durability I could reasonably expect from the Walther P99 pistol.

Apparently the German Government has very strict standards when it comes to any firearm that is being considered for use by them. I believe NATO specs and requirements also come into play for any firearm that might be offered to them as a service weapon, but I'm not sure if that was a factor in the development of the PPS, as the PPS was not designed or intended to be a full service military/police type firearm.

My understanding is that the PPS was in fact designed to replace the popular, but aging PPK series of pistols. (Which are now in fact manufactured and sold by S&W).

I have NOT done the research for the PPS and do not intend to do so. I do, however, intend to buy a PPS which should indicate I expect the new PPS to be of equal quality to the P99. I have in fact read where the PPS was in many areas designed "from" the Walther P99c.

I'm way too old to spend my time researching this issue for you, and you are more than welcome to be a skeptic on the issue, I have no problem with that.

I apologize if I'm a bit touchy regarding your skepticism, but if you think the PPS was designed by two ex-Nazi elves in the Black Forest over a long weekend I suggest you simply lack sufficient knowledge of the history and fine reputation of the firearms the Walther banner represents.

I have no interest in a long winded pissing contest with you regarding the quality of the PPS pistol, I just suggest if you want one, buy one, and if you don't want one, don't buy one.

I have yet to own or shoot a Walther firearm that was not of excellent quality, amazing accuracy, and I do not expect the new PPS to be any different.

Please have the last word, or a thousand words if you so chose.

Regards,

J. Pomeroy

 

[MGMike]

Please have the last word, or a thousand words if you so chose.

Regards,

J. Pomeroy

Naw, not necessary; we've both already said everything we wanted to.

M

 

[Heavy Handed]

Gentlemen - my first time here. Am shopping for a CCW 9mm and have narrowed choices to the Kahr MK9 (yes, I know it's "heavy" but it's lighter than the S&W Model 66 2.5 in I'm carrying now!), the Glock 26 and the new PPS. QUOTE]

Can't speak for the PPS, but have owned and carried a G27 and an MK40. With the exception of caliber, these guns are the same size as their 9mm counterparts. Hands-down the Kahr is a better concealed carry piece. Way smaller than the Glock, better trigger, more accurate, steel frame. Not bashing Glocks, but for a sub-compact, there are better choices.

 

[InfernoMDM]

HeavyHand - Many people have been having problems with Kahr to include a friend who sent his back 7 times. The extractor broke, they sent a new one to him, after about 200 rounds the extractor disappeared on the range. This was all after 5 trips to the Kahr dealer for failure to feed and extract issues.

Some Kahrs are great just do research first.

In all honesty the Kahr has gotten a great deal of acclaim because its metal. I think that is a poor believe because its heavy and metal it will run.

 

[Heavy Handed]

Frankly I haven't owned a single gun that I would recommend without some reservations, but... Speaking for the MK40 I owned, it was a bad-*ss little unit. Digested about 1600rds without a single malfunction. Recoil was lighter than my G27 or my buddy's HKP200SK .40.
I don't think it would have performed enywhere near as well or as comfortably if it was a polymer model. Just my opinion based on personal experience, metal frame guns tend to have fewer personality quirks.
That said, Kahr's quality control is just as weak as every other manufacturer's seems to be in recent years, and your buddy's experience is far from uncommon. I actually approach every new gun purchase with a mix of excitement and dread.