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Discussion Starter #1
Anyone ever hear of PP and P38 going full auto? I stumbled on a caution to Police about handling esp P38 but also PP (no ref to PPK or PPK/S) that may have been modified to go full auto when safety engaged or when slide released
 

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Can't comment on the P38. The PP pistols...all of em, have an internal lever that drops the hammer after the safety drum has been rotated to a position where the firing pin is locked and the hammer blocked from hitting it by the safety drum. I suppose if someone put in the wrong lever, there are nine different ones according to MGMike....then it might be possible to have the lever drop the hammer before the safety has been rotated enough to perform its safety functions. My latest P22 has an internal lever that does the same thing but in a slightly different manner. You would not want the lever to disengage the sear the moment the safety lever was moved. Proper release is when the safety lever is appx. 1/2 way across the red dot. I fail to see how this could make the pistol fire full auto. Then again...anything might be possible with a damaged, worn or modified pistol. 1917
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Warning detailed a modification on PP to remove a part and it would go full auto when slide racked. I wont go into the detail and it is probably unique to a particular vintage. But the implication was that Police should handle guns with suspicion / caution. The P38 was the one where the safety was altered. The inference i took was that they were intentionally modified to be a hazard to police when they encountered such a gun
 

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Interesting. It seems this is an issue being addressed by Walther regarding .32 cal PP pistols. The warning concerns pistols where someone has removed the hammer block and associated spring along with the decocking lever. Semi auto pistols have some mechanism to disconnect whatever is holding the sear clear of the hammer. I haven't ever pulled these parts to test this. But it sounds like perhaps some of these pistols, particularly the Ulm .32 cal police pistols that were in use might have been modified or parts scavenged for some other pistol. I was aware that the hammer block needed to function properly....that fact was pointed out by MGMike in the thread where I purchased a '69 PP in .32 and the hammer would sometimes follow the slide when it closed. Up in the FAQ section. In any event the cure was a new hammer block spring. I put a photo of the existing spring next to the new one....and there wasn't much difference...but enough to make the pistol not function properly.

I'd have to study in more detail the function of the hammer block and how it relates to the decocking lever. This is clearly presented and in color in some of my PP service booklets....I just haven't looked at them lately. This warrants a bit of study. Sounds like good advice for anyone purchasing PP of any kind....make sure the decocker works properly. Field strip to see if all the fixins are there including the hammer block. 1917
 

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Awhile back, someone posted a Zella Mehlis Walther PP in .380 that was select fire.

So yes they exist. Information linked below.

SAMMY!

 

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That layout was so complicated it hardly seemed worth the effort. That is reputed to be a factory effort. The point of which totally escapes me. Full auto 6 or 7 rounds.....??? The above is in regard to pistols where parts had been removed...not a factory prototype if that is even what 198P was. 1917
 

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That layout was so complicated it hardly seemed worth the effort. That is reputed to be a factory effort. The point of which totally escapes me. Full auto 6 or 7 rounds.....??? The above is in regard to pistols where parts had been removed...not a factory prototype if that is even what 198P was. 1917
I agree. Hardly seems practical. More dangerous to bystanders than practical.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Agree this warning is not about a prototype but rather a modification potentially with malicious intent to an unsuspecting person who picks up such a pistol and racks the slide
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Original date of warning was 1996. Thats why i asked if anyone has heard of this. Warning on P38 dates to 1985
 

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Around 1977 I shot one, an old Nazi marked PPK in 32 ACP, that would only go full auto. Load it and zip, you were empty. As I recall it did this as soon as you racked the slide. The sear would not hold the hammer back. I had contemplated buying it if the gunsmith would fix it first, but it proved cost prohibitive for me at the time. I wonder what that gun would be worth today if he had replaced the defective sear.
 

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Two M39 Smiths of mine, and another owned by a buddy, developed a habit of doubling or maybe even a triple. All had been preowned, and it's hard to say what the original owners might have done.
OTOH, a state cop buddy carried a 39 for years; it never acted up.
In any case, pick up any gun and clear it first.
Moon
 

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I had a PP in 32 ACP. Bought it in the early 80's, a West German police trade in that would double occasionally.
Pull the trigger and 2 rounds would go off in very rapid succession. I dont remember being able to get it to do it, or even how I might have tried, it would just surprise me every once in a while. Sold it long ago.
 

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About three years ago I had a German-made PPK/S .380 that I took to a local gunsmith for re-bluing. Upon test firing after the re-finish job, I let the slide fly forward to chamber the first round and suddenly the entire magazine of all 7 rounds did a full-auto burst. (At the time, the decocker/safety was engaged.) Needless to say, that definitely caught me off guard and fortunately I had the weapon pointing down-range at the time.

This continued to happen in both the safety ON and safety OFF modes.

I sent this particular PPK/S off to Earl's Repair Service to ensure the problem was eliminated. Earl called me to say that the gunsmith who had re-blued and subsequently reassembled the weapon, had put the firing pin back into the slide incorrectly and that the firing pin was wedged forward in a protruding manner from the face of the breach. This would cause the firing pin to strike the primer of every cartridge each time the slide cycled and closed.

So yes, a PP series can go "full auto." And yes, I discontinued my patronage to the idiot who claimed he knew how to reassemble a Walther.
 
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