Walther Forums banner

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hello everyone!

I’m a new owner of a Walther P22CA. I would like to try to eliminate the “point” on the hammer to see if it can reduce some of the problems I’ve been having, but I have no experience with metalworking like this and was hoping you guys can help. I need a little bit more guidance on the fine details of the metalwork involved. If it’s too difficult to teach a novice on how to do this, then let me know and I’ll definitely look into finding a local gunsmith who can instead.

For some background on the issues, I took it to the range 2 weeks ago and fired this brand new gun for the first time. I purchased some Winchester M22, 40 grain 1255 FPS ammo from the dealer who assured me that it was great and the Walther P22 should have no problems whatsoever with the ammo. Well, it wasn’t as good as advertised. I probably should have read the posts on this forum first. I guess it doesn’t matter though; CCI mini mags and Remington Golden Bullets are nowhere to be found at this time, so these M22’s are what I’m stuck with.

I seem to have had every single problem listed in previous posts, including spent casing that gets stuck in the barrel, failure to eject casing, failure to feed the next round requiring me to repeatedly rack the slide to get the next bullet in the chamber. It seemed like one of the above problems occurred every other round and I couldn’t seem to predict which problem would happen next. I did do the drop test, dropping a bullet in the chamber and it was able to go in and out smoothly so it seems the barrel is smooth enough.

After reading all of these posts, I first wanted to try and fix the hammer to see if I can get some better results. I’ve gone over the pictures on the P22 Bible, and have an idea and plan to purchase the following:

Sandpaper which include: 320 grit, 400, 600 grit
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07VSFMNCJ/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_HmqgFbJKDJX0Z

Would this suffice or should does anyone have a better recommendation?

I definitely don’t feel comfortable taking down the gun to the point of separating the hammer attachment, so I plan to use the sandpaper directly on the hammer attached to the pistol and then do some cleaning afterwards. I’m thinking about wrapping the sandpaper around a stick, piece of wood or something similar for better contact.

I have attached 2 pictures showing the cocked hammer in its current condition in 2 different views.
93563


93564


I’m hoping you guys can help me confirm that the red arrow is the point that I need to sand away just a bit.

Now for the fine details, I suppose I just start with the 320 grit until the “point” goes away, and then I use the 400 grit for about a minute, and then 600 grit for a minute to get it smoother. Does that seem right?

Now, for the last step, I don’t have a Dremel. What materials do I need to do a proper polishing? Is there any other way to complete the final polish as detailed in the P22 bible?

The 2nd thing I wanted to do was to try and polish the feed ramp, but without a Dremel, I think I might be out of luck on this, unless you have any other suggestions.

Thank you for reading this far. I appreciate any help or other suggestions you guys may have.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,916 Posts
Welcome Hamilton, first I would clean and very lightly lube the pistol. Then I'd load with CCI mini mags or Rem Goldens and go shooting to see if you have any issues. I'm shooting a stock hammer in a 2005 5" pistol with no issues at present. This isn't always the case though with these pistols. Originally the hammer tip was pointed and would catch the slide between the rear of the breech block and safety drum. This would hang up the slide and keep it from closing. The cure was to round the tip a bit. After much discussion Walther finally reshaped the hammer to what you are picturing. I'm not sure what their intention was other than to stop this hang up, and the shape is fairly common on many hammer pistols, but they didn't get it quite right in my opinion. The upper flat area is parallel with the slide when the hammer is cocked and the slide isn't on top of it. The problem is that when the slide is on top of the hammer it presses it down about 0.020" and this tilts the edge (point) between the two faces...making another tip that catches in the little gap between the two parts.

If this causes an issue the cure is simple. Remove just enough material from the tip so that it spans the small gap. But a warning....the overall thickness of the hammer is critical to the slide being able to press it rearward enough for reliable cocking. If you remove too much material from the face of the hammer then the slide will not press it far enough rearward so that the sear can engage the primary hammer hook and hold the hammer cocked..

93575


Above is a photo of a stock hammer showing that indeed the tip created by the intersection of the two faces is where the slide is largely engaging the hammer.
93576


The above photo shows the maximum amount of material that needs to be removed so that the hammer will skip over the small gap between block and safety drum. Yellow arrow. All you might need to do is remove the tiny bit of hammer material showing above the white arc. Then your hammer face profile will look like the curve of the white line. This is easier to do than trying to file the second face down so that it is actually parallel with the bottom of the breech block when under it. Perhaps Walther had a reason for the shape...if so, I never saw it. I think they just forgot to get the angle right when under the breech/safety drum.

If I were doing this with the hammer on the pistol I would make sure the pistol is unloaded, cock the hammer, tape over the rear of the pistol to keep grit out. Make sure my tape was tight against the entire perimeter of the hammer...in other words....seal up the pistol forward of your work area on the hammer. I would also place the hammer in a slightly downward position so that debris will fall clear of the rear of the pistol. Then I would use the fine emery sticks that I had purchased in the fingernail clipper section of the nearest grocery or drug store and lightly begin to rub it back and forth in short strokes across the tip. I'd start with a bit coarser and finish with a very fine. Polish if you like but that won't improve anything. The hammer is fully hardened. Keep your work neat and don't go scratching other parts of the pistol.

I would then wipe it down with a clean rag, give the rear of the hammer a spraying with something like Remington remoil to clean it, wipe it down again. Remove the tape, remove the slide and inspect both the inner hammer/sear area and rear of the slide to make sure no grit got in there. If so, spray it out too, spray it out anyway. Remount the slide, load and shoot. All the so called bible is, is a bunch of my threads from way, way back. I didn't put it together and have no idea what it now says. There has been a lot of water under the bridge since then. Good luck with it, pretty simple. You can do it with emery paper glued to popsicle stick if you like. Emery paper....not sandpaper. You can purchase emery sheets up to 3,000 grit at any auto parts store. I use the fingernail sticks myself for a lot of things. One side very fine, other side fine. Pink is my favorite. 3/4" wide by 6" long. Inexpensive. And remember, more is not better. First I'd go shooting and see if you even need to do this. 1917
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Thanks 1917 for the very detailed instructions! I know it takes up a lot of your time to help out new owners like myself and I really appreciate it. If it wasn't for you and other members of this group that provide advice here, I would probably have lost all hope in getting my P22 in working order.

I definitely will take your advice and do a good cleaning and oiling session before my next round at the range. I purchased the standard Hoppe's solvent to clean and the lubricant to apply afterwards. I found a post where you used Dry Moly and Teflon, but I can't find a lot of details on how to apply them properly for lubrication.

Also, I couldn't find any mini mags online, but I called many of the local ammo stores and was lucky enough to find one that had some CCI mini mag 36 grain hollow points, 300 for $40. I'll definitely be using that on the next round and I'll keep you up to date before I decide to do any modifications.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
674 Posts
As 1911 has said, give it a really good cleaning, especially the chamber and barrel. Some ammo burn dirtier than some of the better ones, such as CCI, and Remington. After you clean it, do the drop test which is to see if a round will drop into and drop out of the camber without help. Many of P22’s need a little bit of break-in, many do not.

I’ve viewed utube videos that breakin time can be reduced by removing the recoil spring and rod, or captured spring depending on model, and rack the slide a couple hundred times. Has worked for me.

Lightly oil the various parts, I use a q-tip And a drop of oil to apply a THIN Coat to the slide rails, and any other flat surface that may contact another one.

It can be a fun little shooter once.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,916 Posts
I went back and actually read your post. Sorry, was in the middle of things. You do not have the best ammo. Winchester and Federal are a bit weak. Failure to extract (spent case still in the chamber) is caused by limp wristing and weak ammo, ammo that is too weak to fully cycle the slide while the spent case hits the ejector hard enough to bounce it out of the ejection port. The extractor plays no part in blowback gasses blowing the spent case rearward with enough energy to cycle thee slide...which involves moving the mass of the slide, compressing the recoil spring, cocking the hammer, overcoming drag and still have enough velocity/energy so that the rim bounces off the ejector. Quite a lot to accomplish with the small round.

The hammer tip does not have much to do with the slide moving rearward. Problems there are due to weak ammo, finger dragging on the slide or limp wristing. The problem the hammer has caused in the past is it can hang up the slide as it moves forward, shoves a round out of the magazine and into the chamber. All of this is accomplished by the recoil spring and sometimes the recoil spring isn't quite up to the task if the hammer is catching in a small notch. But again, this is a slide hang up issue while the slide is moving forward only. Your spent cases remaining in the chamber is due to ammo that is too weak or some other issue....not the hammer tip.

Too bad you can't find some CCI ammo or Rem Goldens....bet your issues would disappear. Weak ammo can be a problem in all short barrel .22 pistols. Semi autos cycle due to blowback gas energy and the short barrel and small round is minimal to begin with. Therefore....high velocity long rifle required...but not all are created equal regardless of the velocity written on the box. Those speeds are out of rifle barrels. Having said that....I fired 50 of your Winchester rounds through a 5" suppressed P22 today without issue but, the longer barrel helps as does the suppressor. Think of it this way....you are getting some good practice in clearing your pistol and dropping the hammer on a spent case is a good way to see if you are flinching. 1917
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,916 Posts
The moly I have is in a dark powder form. Not in a spray on solution. Imagine graphite powder. That is what it looks like. I apply it to the frame rails, top and bottom and slide grooves, top and bottom. I also put some on the bottom rail and the sear.....although some shooters do not put anything on the sear/hammer hook. I rub it on the critical wear areas with a clean Q Tip, lightly dipped into the powder. The stuff won't build up so there is no point in multiple applications. You can rub some on the feed ramp and chamber as well. It wipes off easily enough with a rag sprayed with Remington Remoil. I originally began testing it back in 2005 or so to stop wear between the rails and grooves. KG gun cleaning and lubricants makes a gun grade. It completely stopped wear between the slide and frame. I still use it on the zinc pistol only. One day soon I will need to order some more. 1917
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2 Posts
I’m going pickup my new P2 next week. While researching I ran across this YouTube that might help you
about half way through he show where to file.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,916 Posts
Ha, yep, advice from a guy who can't even get his slide properly remounted.



I did drawings of this issue back in 2005, made several modifications, discussed it with the Chief Engineer in Arnsberg, reprofiled the rear safety drum and breech block. That all worked fine, Walther told me they tried it and couldn't make it work. They did however finally reprofile the hammer face but in my opinion did not get that entirely correct. For the new hammer, leave the safety drum alone, you might and i say might need to lightly dress the tip on the face of the hammer, because many stock hammers work fine without having the small tip removed.



Who can remember this modification and how it worked? 1917
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
Thanks for the advice everyone, I appreciate your time!

I'm hoping I won't need to polish the hammer. We'll see! I gave it a good cleaning and lightly applied some Hoppe's lubricant for now. In the future I'll have to look into that dry lubricant. With the description that 1911 gave, it looks like this is the KG moly brand: KG KG-10 Micro Moly Dry Lubricant 2oz Bottle

It took a while to figure out how to put the uncaptured spring rod back in using the guide rod, but I finally got it.

I'm hopeful of getting some good results the next time I hit the firing range, especially with the CCI ammo. I'm still a bit worried the Hollow Point may have some feeding issues. I'll keep you guys up to date after I give it a try.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,916 Posts
Look at post #17 I think for an explanation of how to remount the slide. Easiest thing ever if you use something to guide the spring as Walther recommends. 1917

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,916 Posts
Hollow points are not an issue in a P22. The critical thing is ammo that is powerful enough out of a short barrel to cycle the slide. The CCI will work 100%. 1917
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Update

Used up about 100 rounds of CCI minimags today at the range, and I could definitely see a big difference. This premium ammo was able to cycle the slide much more efficiently. Out of 100, only 2 had a problem with loading the next round into the chamber, with the the round stuck right between the feed ramp and the chamber. I believe it might be because the feed ramp was starting to get dirty or perhaps I just need to polish the feed ramp.

I tried the Winchester ammo again at the end. About 5 out of the 20 rounds did not push the slide back far enough to bring in the next round into the chamber. In contrast to above, the bullet was still in the magazine and wasn't even on the feed ramp. Also, I had one light strike, but the frustrating part was when I racked the slide it would not eject the ammo. I tried what 1911 recommended for another user and pushed on the extractor at the distal end to try and get a better hold of the bullet but it still didn't work. I just found something to stick through the barrel to push it back out. I wonder if replacing the extractor would help with this?

So at the end of the day, the CCI mini mags made a huge difference in the consistency and reliability of this gun. Do you think once I go through about 1,000 rounds or so I'll be able to start using the weaker Winchester rounds? or should I just find a way to sell the ammo and just stick with CCI only?

Thank you!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,916 Posts
A couple of things you mentioned indicate you might need to clean the chamber. An unfired round should drop in with a plop and fall out if you tilt the pistol upward. Periodically the magaines need cleaning as well. Yes too weak ammo with not blow the slide rearward enough for the breech rail to get behind the next round in the magazine. A round or spent case stuck in the chamber is usually an indication of a dirty chamber. Always take a cleaning rod, clean rag, some patches, light oil and a brass .22 brush for periodic cleaning should you foul the chamber. 100 rounds of mini mags should not cause that though.

Always be triple careful driving a live round out from the muzzle. Drop the mag, place the safety on safe. Firm grip on the pistol, slide locked back, even a hand around the slide to make sure it stays back. Lightly tap the round out. A stuck round causes two problems. First the round didn't likely seat which allows it to give with the first firing pin strike. A second strike usually fires the now seated round. Then the case may or may not extract and eject. Usually an indication of a dirty chamber.

If you have more problems with the mini mags, your chamber and mags are clean and you are holding the pistol with a firm grip....then we will have to look at the possibility of a bad chamber. Warranty item. I've never had to break any of these pistols in. 1917
 
1 - 15 of 15 Posts
Top