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Discussion Starter #1
I recently picked up an nickel slide P22 from a gun show because my wife fell in love with the feel/looks and I figured it would be nice to shoot along side my P99AS. It was an interesting buy because it was basically just a collector item of the gentleman who sold it. Despite being an '05 model the gun had never been fired.

So I've been trying to break it in and testing different ammo. CCI mini-mag HPs are 100% (about 50 rounds) as are Aguila super extras (only 20 rounds or so). I had a box of Winchester 333 that I started with before I could find some higher quality stuff and I put maybe 150-200 rounds through it. As you can imagine, the brand new (10 year old?) gun doesn't love feeding it, specifically the first couple rounds in a magazine. It seems like there isn't quite enough pressure from the rounds to overcome the extra friction from the fully loaded magazine.

However since I noticed that the Winchesters seemed to be reliable after the first couple rounds I wanted to try mixing it up the Wins with higher quality rounds. The first two shots are mini-mags and the rest are Winchesters in the magazine... Sure enough, it cycles them 100% just like they were all mini-mags!

I was just wondering if anyone else had any experience with this and if there's any reason why this shouldn't be done. I just kind of figured it might be a nice way to shoot through some cheap stuff without having to buy tons of mini-mags. Thanks!
 

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I've got a BC (2012) P22...it was much like yours, first round or so won't feed, after that, nothing to it.

I've since milled down the hammer face and clipped a coil off of the spring.

I wouldn't recommend this unless you're mechanically savvy, and careful, as too much off, is...too much off. I could still take more, but it works now, so I left it alone.

To me, it came down to having a single shot P22, or else I could just save time and postage by "fixing" it myself.

Also, google up the P22 Bible, it's full of good info on how to make your little plinker into a reliable frog and squirrel bagger.

I imagine 1911 will be along shortly with some good advice...he's spot on, knows his P22 stuff. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I'm familiar with the P22 bible, I've read it through and I already cleaned up my trigger ear bar a bit.

I was considering taking a bit off of the hammer next, but I wanted to wait until it's a little more broken in to see how it operates first. With only 250-300 rounds through it, mostly being the cheap stuff, I figured that it's not fully broken in at this point.

And with my mixed ammo system so far it's been great, as long as this doesn't pose any problems... However it would be nice to be confident that it would operate 100% reliably on any 10 rounds I try to feed it, not having to rely on high quality stuff for the first 2 shots.

btw, that's the recoil spring you clipped, right?
 

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Good advice....you bet....buy land boys and girls. God ain't making any more and I just happen to have 20 acres here in town I'd like to get rid of. :) M1911

Some rounds are just too weak to blow the slide back which must cock the hammer, compress the recoil spring and drag over the tip of a waiting round. A 5" barrel helps here as does a firm grip and more powerful .22 ammo. Mini Mags and Remington Golden bullets. The next problem a P22 can have is the slide hanging up on the hammer on the way forward. So, clipping the recoil spring actually takes spring strength away for chambering the next round. But, a slick gun and one with the rear breech block mod will allow the slide to close easily as the now cocked hammer does not even touch the slide while it is on the way back forward. If you want to feel the amount of hammer drag just remove the recoil spring and then slide the slide back and forth across the hammer face. I've got to get a plan out for a 4 pm meeting. See you guys later. M1911
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited by Moderator)
Good advice....you bet....buy land boys and girls. God ain't making any more and I just happen to have 20 acres here in town I'd like to get rid of. :) M1911
Thanks for the advice! Would you recommend doing the rear breech block mod before the gun is fully broken in? I think I'd rather do that than take anything off the hammer since that's external and would be visible.

Regarding mixing ammo, do you see any problem with that? It seems to work...
 

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The ammo mix is fine. Good solution. Finding the ammo of your preference is the real trick. Just keep shooting until something aggravates you enough and then you can take a look at it. More powerful rounds really cure a lot of P22 issues. Semi auto .22 pistols with short barrels really ask a lot of the relatively low powered .22. And, some don't have much power to begin with. Others are much more robust and will slap the slide back for more rebound on the forward trip. M1911
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Good to know. And thanks for the tips... Everything you've said makes perfect sense, and the reasoning behind the modifications in the P22 bible became much clearer after I racked the slide without the recoil spring. There's definitely a lot of friction going on there.

I'll probably stick to the mixed ammo for a while. If it still hasn't broken in enough to cycle the bulk stuff after 500 rounds or so I'm thinking the breech block mod will be my next step.
 

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By the time I took a little off the hammer face, I'd ran over a thousand rounds through mine, and still had some issues, so for me, it was an easy decision. I like my stuff to work right, and if it doesn't, I'm not a happy camper and out come the tools and whatnot.

There's still some material I *could* remove, as well as notch out the safety drum, and I just might later on if it it gives any more issues with the cheaper ammo brands, but for now, it's pretty decent.

And yes, it's the recoil spring I clipped, my apologies for not mentioning that in my first post :eek:;).

Also, if I have 10 rounds in a mag, and use the slide release, it rarely chambers the first round completely. Tradeoff for a clipped spring, I reckon. One of these days, I'll order a new spring and likely mill the hammer down a bit more and experiment with the combo. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited by Moderator)
By the time I took a little off the hammer face, I'd ran over a thousand rounds through mine, and still had some issues, so for me, it was an easy decision. I like my stuff to work right, and if it doesn't, I'm not a happy camper and out come the tools and whatnot. ...
Haha I'm with you there, if I get to a thousand and it's still not cycling those I'm gonna pull out the emery cloth :D

No worries, I was pretty sure that was the spring you were talking about... Just wanted to be sure. I wish they just made a slightly softer recoil spring, it seems (in my case at least) that everything is just a hair away from functioning perfectly. If I do make any more modifications I really doubt it's going to take much.
 

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Just remember you can't get carried away with removing material from the hammer face. There must be enough for the safety drum or breech block to press the hammer far enough rearward so the sear will engage so you have a fully cocked hammer. As measured from the rear of the hammer to the face you should always have just a bit more than 1/2". 0.53" works. All that needs doing is to remove the small point on the face. Takes about 1 min but is easier done with the hammer out of the pistol. Make sure you clean everything thoroughly when grinding or polishing on steel parts that are next to the sear, hammer pin and slide/frame rails. M1911
 

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I have cured most all P22s that friends asked me to mend that had such issues (FTFeed/FTFire), by simply asking them to leave their P22 in the safe (empty of ammo), with the slide locked open. It takes 10 days to a month to weaken the P22's main and hammer springs. Once both become tad weaker with this method, they work well together afterwards. It's all a matter of timing. Repeat this procedure (open breech with the slide drawn back), once a year for, say a week, to prevent them from getting stiff again.

Think about it: the HV vs Standard ammo does just that for a millisecond in each shot, it weakens the spring for the next shot. As the HV slams the springs with force any Standard or Subsonic in the mag well will load-fire-extract etc. Doing the breech-open-trick weakens both springs for the duration so standard and subsonics will feed and extract reliably afterwards without resorting to a mixed bag of ammo and use the P22 carefree of feeding issues in the long run.
 

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Welcome GTEE12 ! Hey, you mentioned in your first post that you figured you had an '05' model. Did it come with 2 mags? You might want to check and see if they are the short slot mags instead of the long slot ones. The short slot mags look like this:



And the long slot ones look like this:



The short slot mags did not allow the rounds to stack properly and did cause feeding problems. My P22 came with short slot mags and Walther
or I should say Smith and Wesson parts service for Walther , replaced mine with the good long slot ones and these do the job. Just wondering...
 

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Hmm interesting, mine does have 2 mags and they both look to be the short slot mags. My feeding problems haven't seemed to be huge, I just attributed them to the gun break-in period since it feeds good ammo no problem. But do you think that getting the replacement mags would help?

If so, how would I go about getting replacements? Do I just need to go out and buy some?


And Crete, interesting tip. Thinking back to my college days, I was always under the impression that spring weakening was due to cycling and not static compression. But I'm and electrical engineer so what do I know? :) If you have experience that this works I may give it a try.
 

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With my method both mags work just fine. I never understood why the short slot mags were malfunctioning. I always thought that it was an urban legend. I got mine with short slots and worked well. Then I was sent two new replacement mags with long slots. Go figure. I still can't see what the fuss was/is all about them slots :confused:

At my Club there are 5 or 6 P22s that work with mixed-slot (short and long) mags and they shoot flawlessly regardless. They all had my slide-open trick done to them as described earlier on.

Cheers.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
So you talked to S&W about the replacements? How long ago was that and was it still under warranty?
 

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I think the mag lips were too close together as well as the short slot not allowing the rounds to stagger enough. It looks like when you fill the mag the top round is not sticking up/out correctly. I would get dry fires instead of a round feeding correctly. Sometimes I would only put in 5 rounds and it would still mess up. The long slot ones fixed all that for me.
 

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So you talked to S&W about the replacements? How long ago was that and was it still under warranty?
It was out of warranty (pretty sure) and they just said send in the old ones and they sent out new ones. I do not think this is still the case however. Here is the new info....

Walther/Umarex Customer Service:
Walther Arms, Inc
7700 Chad Colley Blvd
Fort Smith, AR 72916
(479) 242-8500
Walther Arms
 

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JBR is right. I have about 10 of those and none of them are any good. Some I can't even get 10 rounds into. Having said that is did do some careful measurements of the width of the lips and found that if I widened then from 0.019' to about 0.021".....they began to work fine. Don't hold me to the measurements. That was a few years ago but there is a thread on it around here somewhere. The short slots were an attempt by Walther to correct ejection direction. I guess that can be told now that it is history. It didn't work and neither did the mags. They were shortly replaced by the long slot B mags. M1911
 
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