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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Well it's been nearly a week with Hoppe's #9 and Tetra gun lube on the S&W plastic PPK grips. I couldn't wait any longer and wiped both off. There was nowhere near the amount of disintegration that I had previously. But of the two, Hoppe's #9 did seem to be more destructive. I tried wetting a paper towel with #9 and then rubbing it on a perfect, smooth, untouched section of the PPK grip. The end result was that section was no longer shiny but turned a sort of grey streaked color. So it definitely was negatively affected. Tetra gun lube did not have this effect.

So the bottom line is I think Hoppe's #9 should NOT be allowed to touch the S&W/Walther PPK grips. If you are gonna use Hoppe's #9 to clean the gun, either be VERY careful to avoid getting it on the grips, or remove the grips completely prior to cleaning. Note that I have NEVER experienced Hoppe's #9 having a negative effect on ANY plastic grips in the past.

I am currently testing alternative lubricants, cleaners, and preservatives, including Hoppe's Elite oil and cleaner, Ballistol, and Slip 2000 products. I have eliminated from my inventory G-96 CLP and Tetra products. While I wasn't able to absolutely verify that Tetra products were totally harmless to plastic, I simply don't think it's worth the risk. There are equal or better lubes out there and I don't have a fixation or loyalty to just one. G-96 was a dismal failure as a cleaner and only mediocre as a lube and preservative. Only good thing I can say about G-96 is it smells nice. I have a goodly amount of Break Free CLP, but I was NOT impressed with it's qualities as a cleaner. As a lube and preservative, it works quite well. CLP Break Free does NOT remove copper jacket fouling from a barrel, so if you use FMJ ammo, you HAVE to use a seperate bore cleaner to remove the jacket fouling.

Dep



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For what it's worth, and for anyone still keeping score on this muddled thread ...

... after finishing up at the range yesterday with the P5, the P99, and the PPK/S, I spent some time cleaning the three guns. I first used a swab and ran some Hoppe's No. 9 through the bore of each. Just for curiosity's sake, I took a fesh patch and ran some CLP through -- and couldn't believe how dirty it was when it came out, even after the Hoppe's. :confused:

Beats me as to the why, but I'm thinking about doing that every time out from now on (recognizing that CLP doesn't remove copper leftovers from FMJ ammo). Next time out, though, I'll run the CLP swab through first and then follow it up with the Hoppe's and see if that makes any difference.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Searcher: Tomorrow I will be using Ballistol exclusively. I am REAL curious as to how this stuff works as a CLP. All those black powder users can't ALL be full of poop :D
Ballistol smells pretty funky for about 15 minutes, then it is odorless. It's 100% environmentally friendly, so no worries about it causing more global warming :rolleyes:
It also cleans out carbon AND metal fouling from the barrel. The big question is just how well it does this. ;)

Dep



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For what it's worth, and for anyone still keeping score on this muddled thread ...
Apparently the only muddled individual here is yours truly, who didn't spot the fact that this was a separate thread entirely at the time that I posted my initial note here.

Mea culpa, gentlemen. May someone scrub me out with a wire brush and little Hoppe's No. 9. :eek:
 

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Discussion Starter #5

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im curious

why would anyone put a powder solvent on plastic grips?
2nd, why would one expect a powder solvent to clean brass residue?

im confused...
 

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Discussion Starter #8
im curious

why would anyone put a powder solvent on plastic grips?
2nd, why would one expect a powder solvent to clean brass residue?

im confused...
LOL...I didn't PUT IT ON the grips. The grips were on the gun when I was using Hoppe's #9. A very small amount of it got on the grips and corroded part of them.
2nd: Many solvents clean multiple contaminants of a gun. Hoppes #9 removes "powder, lead, metal fouling, and rust." That's straight from their website.

Some CLP products also clean brass/copper residue. Ballistol is one. If you use a copper/brass SPECIFIC cleaner like Sweet's 7.62, you have to be VERY careful. It contains a large dose of ammonia and could be harmful to barrels as well as other parts. If you do use it make sure you oil the barrel after use.

Dep



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For my tests of Franchi and Ballistol, go here:
http://www.waltherforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=6260
Excellent report as usual, Dep. Thanks for sharing the results. I'll be picking up a couple of cans of Ballistol on my next trip through Gunland Central (WallyWorld? Sportsman's Warehouse?) and give it a whirl.

On another note at the core of this topic, I checked with my local gunsmith about his experience with Hoppe's No. 9. He indicated that he has used it for years, has recommended it for years, and has never known of a problem nor heard of a bad incident or experience with it. When I relayed your problems with the PPK grips, he gave it about a half-second of consideration and came to the conclusion -- as have many, no doubt -- that the grips themselves were the culprit here and not the Hoppe's. I can't recall now, but did you ever ask the S&W folks if they had changed the formula of the plastic they are using or perhaps used a secondary outside vendor or otherwise did something different that might account for the initial problem? The last time I cleaned my PPK/S S&W, I was damned careful when I ran some Hoppe's No. 9 through the bore. But it didn't stop me from using the Hoppe's.

The whole thing is an odd puzzle, to be sure. It has, however, pointed out some cleaning tips that have doubtless benefited forum members. And for that, sir, I thank you. :)
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Searcher: The guy who took the initial order for replacement grips INSISTED it was Hoppe's that was at fault This is the same goofball that sent me grips for a PPK/S. So I don't put a lot of credence in what he said. I agree that the grips could be and probably ARE the problem. I've used Hoppe's #9 for DECADES (that alone is scary) and never had a problem with it on plastic or wood. I used Hoppe's #9 to take the cosmolene off Soviet M91 rifles as well as 1903 Springfield rifles and it worked great....even on the wood. If a person wanted to continue using Hoppe's #9 to clean their S&W/Walther pocket pistols, my only suggestion would be that you be VERY careful about NOT getting it on the grips. Or to be totally safe, remove the grips before cleaning. I never did find out if the grips cracked as a result of the Hoppe's #9 or the Tetra. But it's always wise to play it safe. Of course, when my Eagle grips arrive, the worry about Hoppe's #9 will be eliminated. But I have already switched to Ballistol as my #1 cleaner and lube, and RIG +P for my grease. As to Ballistol, it's actully MADE to be used on wood leather and plastic too. Heck, it is used on wounds on the human body to help prevent infections and aid in healing. NO carcinogenic contents in it AT ALL. Can't get more user-friendly than that :D

Dep



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How in heaven's name could anyone claim that Hoppe's #9 would/could melt modern day palstic grips, or, alternatively sell a gun where the grips could be melted by Hoppe's? I rarely remove grips when I clean a gun and Hoppe's is going to get on the grips unless extreme measures are taken. Hoppe's gets on your hands and it gets on grips. I've been cleaning guns for 30 years and have never had a concern about getting Hoppe's on any part of a gun.

On the other hand, years ago I did melt a set of Sig P220 grips (European model) using Birchwood Casey guns scrubber :mad:

The problem was with the grips.

Q
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Que: I tend to agree with you that the grips ARE the problem. I suspect S&W probably gets the grips from a seperate supplier, maybe even from a 3rd world country. That seems to be fairly common practice these days with just about everything. Hoppe's #9 DOES have ammonia in it's contents, but according to them it's a "neutral formulation" and shouldn't harm anything.
I NEVER remove grips when I clean guns, and never had a problem like this one. Corroding plastic and split in 3 locations, bad news for sure. :mad:
Just a fair warning to those that use Hoppe's #9 when cleaning S&W Walther pocket pistols....this COULD happen to you.

BTW...I find it highly interesting that Walther states quite clearly in their P-99 instructions to USE Hoppe's #9 to clean that gun. :D

Dep



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BTW...I find it highly interesting that Walther states quite clearly in their P-99instructions to USE Hoppe's #9 to clean that gun.
Dep
Yes, that is interesting!

Putting something on a gun that could be melted by Hoppe's would be crazy as it is the most commonly used cleaner around, at least in the US.

I suspect there was a bad batch of plastic involved.

Q
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Well it's either bad plastic or plastic that is cheap crap and not up to spec. I never had either of my two previous PPK/S grips have this happen to them. But they were both Interarms.

The two good things that came out of this fiasco, is I have a set of Ebony grips on order from Eagle that should look very cool, and I have re-discovered Ballistol for cleaning, lubricating, and preserving my guns :) BTW...Ballistol was invented in Germany...I find that highly appropriate :D



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