Is this a record?

2303 Views 21 Replies 10 Participants Last post by Nola, Sep 23, 2018

Nola

Discussion Starter · Aug 29, 2018 (Edited)

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/782609072

Is this a record for a standard production line postwar PPK? It does look nice but what sets it apart? Standard retail model with import marks for government or law enforcement. Any ideas?

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

MGMike

· #2 · Aug 30, 2018

Nola said:
...It does look nice but what sets it apart? ...

What sets it apart is that the seller is deeply religious. He is fervently praying for the appearance of suckers who swallow "rare".

I too am deeply religious. I am fervently praying that the bids are real and he is successful and sets a new price threshold for ordinary garden-variety German PPK pistols. I have one also (that might be for sale, depending), and I am drinking holy water instead of wine tonight, waiting...and preparing to prey.

M

Reactions: 5

Vandal320

· #3 · Aug 30, 2018

I wonder if the buyer got a kiss or a reach around during that screwing. "Bite the pillow I'm going in dry"...

TheWatcher

· #4 · Aug 30, 2018

Interesting that the last 2 bidders only had 1 and 2 previous transactions on the website.

Kar98

· #5 · Aug 30, 2018

Well, it IS an absolutely, 110% pristine 1981 PPK (not a PPK/S!)... but damn, that's about three grand more than I'd be willing to pay.

Reactions: 2

Nola

Discussion Starter · #6 · Aug 30, 2018

It could be that they were inexperienced in researching comparable sales or it could simply be that each bidder saw this as as nice as he was likely to find and the money did not really matter compared to the wait for the next one as nice to come up for auction. Most "NIB" have visible flaws. This is as off the wall as I have seen without some special edition status or even a presentation case. These guys need to expand their range of contacts if they have that kind of money to spend.

For comparison, this is a similar item that would serve as a nice shooter in the same category and year range.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/784387587

It will serve as an object lesson for anyone hoping that a new trend is starting.

I don't begrudge the winner the pleasure of ownership though. It was worth it if it was worth it to him.

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Reactions: 1

Kar98

· #7 · Aug 30, 2018

On a related subject:

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/781301290

That has got to be a joke!?

Reactions: 2

Vandal320

· #8 · Aug 30, 2018 (Edited)

mUh 1960 cOmMuNiSt bLoCk eAsT gErMaN mAkArOv!!!!

Reactions: 1

CJS57

· #9 · Aug 31, 2018

SRC gets 20% to 100% more than other dealers. I sold him an M1 Marlin 22 for $175 on NR GB auction. He resold for about $500 on his NR GB auction. People pay more to him for the same gun elsewhere for some reason. Rick C. has been a dealer since way back always with top shelf items. I got $2200 for the same NIB PPK, He gets $3500 but those are real people buying the guns not shill.

Reactions: 1

Nola

Discussion Starter · #10 · Aug 31, 2018

That is a great point. The reputation of a dealer matters. Another case in point is Earl's Repair Shop. His prices are always higher than you will see at online auctions but his reputation is impeccable and NIB means just that if you buy from him. I am guessing this dealer is the same.

Reactions: 1

MGMike

· #11 · Aug 31, 2018 (Edited)

CJS57 said:
SRC gets 20% to 100% more than other dealers. ... People pay more to him for the same gun elsewhere for some reason. Rick C. has been a dealer since way back always with top shelf items. I got $2200 for the same NIB PPK, He gets $3500 but those are real people buying the guns not shill.

Forgive me if I remain unimpressed with that explanation. It does not satisfactorily account for an apparent willingness to pay 140% to 200% of what the most cursory research would suggest the item is worth. Those might be "real people" who "win" the guns, but I submit they are either lazy or stupid.

Auctions, especially on the internet where the players remain anonymous and manipulative games that sellers and bidders have been known to play can be masked, are a target-rich environment for the unscrupulous.

It happens on Wall Street every single day; why should this be any different?

M

Reactions: 4

Kar98

· #12 · Aug 31, 2018

If it wasn't for the lazy and stupid, many of us wouldn't have a job 😉

Reactions: 1

MGMike

· #13 · Aug 31, 2018

Kar98 said:
If it wasn't for the lazy and stupid, many of us wouldn't have a job...

Well, I wouldn't argue with that.

M

bakersfieldkelley

· #14 · Sep 2, 2018

PPk price

I am loving it! I have a NIB 67 PPk, no Interarms marking, has a tiny, tiny blue wear at muzzle just from sitting in the box, moving from place to place, 7.65. Unfired. Bought it 1967 for $60 at Simms Hardware in Sacramento. My first Walther and not for sale at any price! However, you might contact my wife when I check out. I'm 82.

Reactions: 5

Nola

Discussion Starter · #15 · Sep 8, 2018

I am not sure I agree that cursory research puts the maximum price of actual new in the box postwar PPK's from any year at $2500. There are a ton of minor compromised in condition "like new in the box" guns for less but this particular gun appears to be the real deal and is backed by a seller with a reputation for acquiring such guns.

Do I think the price was high? Definitely. That is why I made my original post. Is this a "rare black box gun"? In the US I think that is at least defensible for post GCA PPK's that could only be imported under special circumstances. Personally I don't see it as a value enhancement though. Arguably it might work the other way. The older pristine gun would seem more desirable.

There is a Rock Island Auction proceeding this weekend with a number of examples. Only one of the PPK's is described as "near new". I am interested to see what "prices realized" are posted next week at the conclusion of the auction.

It may seem insane but it is clear that collectors are willing to pay a large premium for what seems to many of us as small gradations of condition. I am interested in what drives these pricing considerations. I can understand the more practical perspective that 98-99% is plenty good enough. On the other hand I want to know what premium truly "new in the box" can add in the form of realistic value that can be duplicated at auction. I had never seen any non-specialty PPK go for anything like $3500. It is easy to dismiss this as madness but harder to ascertain at what price point "buyer's frenzy" became the paramount consideration in the bidding.

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halfmoonclip

· #16 · Sep 9, 2018

"...lazy and stupid.." may be overstating it, but it's close.
Colt was marketing an M-16A1 clone (there was some question if Hartford actually made them) for $2500, complete with US and faux auto markings.
They apparently sold out in no time.
An actual SP1 could have been had for $700 less, but the new guns were there, perfect, and Colt marked.
It's easier to just reach for the checkbook.
Moon
ETA So ya' know, I built my A1 from NOS Colt parts and a NoDak lower. No pony or fake buzz switch, $739.
M

Nola

Discussion Starter · #17 · Sep 23, 2018

This ongoing auction from the same vendor is also remarkable. Generic German 380 PPK/s with no box, papers, or finger rest magazine being sold "as new." At this point I am becoming suspicious of the pictures too. Correct gun but possible tricks to mask flaws. Check out the price before the auction is even over.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/785535247

yagyujubei

· #18 · Sep 23, 2018

I don't see the point in inferring that the seller is a cheat. His feedback couldn't be better. It's a beautiful gun.

Nola

Discussion Starter · #19 · Sep 23, 2018

Fair enough.

RIngo

· #20 · Sep 23, 2018

As MGMike has said . . . its easily 150-200% higher than genuine market value, and whoever "wins" it, probably supports 'sanctuary cities' and firmly believes that Khloe Kardashian is an "executive" producer. But this drag-line phenomenon is nothin' new. You should see what goes on with the on-line sale/resale of electric guitars!!

So-called 'boutique" guitar builders will take a perfectly stock production guitar of roughly $1500 value, scratch the livin' hell out of it, dip it in acid, and sell it to some fool on E-bay as a "relic" for $6,000+. Its just another spin on the age-old Calvin Klein ("designer") product campaign that Gen-X-er's and millennials have all made famous.

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