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German Polizei stamps

3321 Views 20 Replies 8 Participants Last post by  Andyd_is_PzGren, 
GonzoGeezer
Is there a list somewhere showing the acceptance/ownership stamps used by German Polizei departments? While some are obvious (NDS, ByP, the Hessian Lion, etc) some, like this one elude me.

Any help appreciated.

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CAR
I believe that is a West Berlin Police acceptance stamp.



I have seen that same stamp on many Manurhin marked P-38s
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GonzoGeezer
Thanks. Using West Berlin in a search confirmed it.
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A
For the Walthers, Dieter Marschall’s book has a list of the stampings in the back.

If you ever see that West Berlin police star on a PPK, jump on it if you can afford it. The Berliners didn’t buy any PP’s, but acquired a batch of PPK’s for the Kripo (detectives). None were sold off before 1968, so while they can be found relatively inexpensively on the European collector market, none could be imported. So any that made it here would have had to come in on a law enforcement exemption or such, and be pretty much a unicorn for US collectors.
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GonzoGeezer
I was looking at one of the West Berlin P1s but it was more than I I wanted to pay.
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9
Gonzo - is your Berlin pistol stamped with "Made in West Germany?" When I was stationed there 80-83, I believe none of the West Berlin police firearms were "Germany" marked because of the ongoing occupation status of Berlin. My guess is it's a French Manurhin.
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matthanne
I can't see his, but as for my P1, the slide is already marked 'Made in France' and 9mm, so it seems that the importer had only to mark his name and location on the right frame over the trigger.
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GonzoGeezer
The 13,600+ Manurhin-finished P1s purchased by the West Berlin police have the West Berlin sunburst on the left front area of the trigger guard. They are stamped Manurhin and Made in France.
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9
All Manuhrin then. That's all I remember seeing for pistols there. The West Berlin border police also carried machine pistols but I don't recall the type or markings.
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GonzoGeezer
West Berlin authorities were forbidden German-made weapos by the Four Powers Agreement, thus the Manurhin subterfuge . Some border guards carried P210-4s but I don’t know if it was during this same time period.
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Andyd_is_PzGren
3
The BGS had ordered 5,000 SIG P210-4 and many of those that I have had the opportunity to inspect had seen only mild use. I would guess, and it is nothing else than a guess, that the P210-s spent a lot of time in the armouries.

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GonzoGeezer
I so want one of these.
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Andyd_is_PzGren
GonzoGeezer said:
I so want one of these.
Click to expand...
The P210-4 in the last pic, together with the 210-6 is still my favourite shooter. I actually prefer the service style trigger and the slightly higher trigger weight, it has a 1000 gr spring, while the sport pistols, the -5 and -6 have a 500 gr trigger spring and slightly differently shaped trigger blade ( and adjustable trigger stop in the -5/6). The screwed in hammer unit makes absolutely no difference, there is no wiggle in either.

Because of its relative rarity, having been built only 5000 times plus a 1,000 unit commemorative model, the prices for them are quite a bit higher than for the Swiss Army or privately owned 49/210-2s. I will put a correct bakelite grip on this 49 and make it my new shooter, my range queen:).

These guns shoot and handle way to well to be relegated to safe queen status.

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M
DE Pistole said:
... The West Berlin border police also carried machine pistols but I don't recall the type or markings.
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They used the Walther MPL, but Manurhin-marked.

The motorcycle cops had neat leather scabbards for them.

M
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GeoNole94
GonzoGeezer said:
I so want one of these.
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The link below might help with your research. The P210-1 is probably the apex of my collection, and includes 9mm Para and 7.65 Luger barrels, plus a .22 conversion kit. They are incredibly smooth pistols to rack, sort of like the slide is on ball bearings. Balance and shootability are terrific. The overall frame size is comparable to a 1911. My goal is to get a clean -6 Heavy Frame, but the prices are.....significant.

https://larvatus.livejournal.com/33732.html
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A
GonzoGeezer said:
West Berlin authorities were forbidden German-made weapos by the Four Powers Agreement, thus the Manurhin subterfuge . Some border guards carried P210-4s but I don’t know if it was during this same time period.
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Andyd_is_PzGren said:
The BGS had ordered 5,000 SIG P210-4 .....
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Just to be clear that these are two separate topics:

The Bundesgrenzschutz (BGS) had no presence or jurisdiction in West Berlin. Besides the Allies, the border around West Berlin was patrolled by the W. Berlin police and Zoll (customs), who also carried Manurhin P1's and were separate from the Federal Zoll.

MGMike said:
They used the Walther MPL, but Manurhin-marked.
...
Click to expand...
They even had a Manurhin variant of the West German Rheinmetall MG.

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9
Sure glad the wall came down - it was an ugly and sad thing for sure.
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M
DE Pistole said:
Sure glad the wall came down - it was an ugly and sad thing for sure.
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You might be, but there were many Germans who were not especially keen to see it. Unification was less important than its economic consequences, most of which were adverse. Communism had ruined East Germany to the point, in the view of some, of making it an economic burden to reintegrate.

M
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Germans in my family (to include my father) saw it as a sad and ugly thing. A place where those seeking only their freedom were shot down in cold blood.
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GonzoGeezer
MGMike said:
You might be, but there were many Germans who were not especially keen to see it. Unification was less important than its economic consequences, most of which were adverse. Communism had ruined East Germany to the point, in the view of some, of making it an economic burden to reintegrate.



M
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And the effort continues, with the government still pushing for business growth in the states of the former DDR, but growth lags and unemployment is still too high. Having Angela Merkel as chancellor has had some benefit for the effort; she probably still recalls what it was like before 1990.
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