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Discussion Starter #1
Hello all,

I'm loving my PPQ, but having serious difficulty finding any lead loads that will lock the slide back once the final round has been fired. If I shoot factory copper rounds, it will lock back no problem.

Here have been my loads:

1. 135gn round nose coated lead bullet over 3.3gn Universal Clays at 1.14 inch oal.

2. 124gn flat nose coated lead bullet over 3.5gn?? (can't exactly remember here) Universal Clays at 1.14 inch and 1.12 oal.

3. 147gn flat nose coated lead bullet over 3.2gn Universal Clays at 1.14 inch OAL.

4. 147gn flat nose coated lead bullet over 4.5gn Alliant Unique at 1.115 inch OAL.

Sadly, here in Australia currently my powder choice is very limited to just those two powders. I'm using the Unique at the moment as it's a lot more suitable than Universal Clays (not to be confused with Universal).

All those loads more than made minimum power factor. In fact, the fourth load is way over at around 153 power factor. The gun bucks like I'm shooting factory. But still the slide wont lock back on the final round.

Any and all help appreciated!

Cheers,

Jba
 

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Simple question, but are you sure it's the load, and not you riding the slide?


I ran much lighter loads last year, and the only time the slide did not lock back, was when I started shooting, and I was riding the slide, once I corrected that, I never had the problem again. No parts needed.
 

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This might not be worth mentioning, but I'll do it in case maybe it's an option.
First, I have had no problems and shooting some ammo as low as around 121gr. (I think that's what they handed me at CHL qualifying) this was after my change. I read one review where the guy loved everything about the PPQ but thought recoil was just too "snappy" for a full frame 4", being polymer is the reason , which he didn't mention. So, before I had a chance to even fire the pistol, I bought the DPS recoil reduction system. Replacing the guiderod ( plastic even) is a SS rod with a spring plunger on one end, and two seperate outside springs, one for normal ammo, another slightly stronger for +P ammo.

Now look, it does work, I don't know it actual percentage of lessened recoil, maybe
3-5% vertical reduction? It's was $85 investment and an opportunity to get rid of that polymer guide rod I hated. I would hate for you to invest in a part for your weapon that wouldn't fix a symptom your unhappy with already though, sure you'd have the recoil reduction system, but if it didn't solve your slide not locking back, you'd still have that to deal with.

I will add my PPQ racks easier now with the DPS system, just normal use feels easier now, and now I'm used to and don't want to change anything as I seem to shoot better then ever before and have gotten compliment last two times out by total strangers watching thru the glass. (Once was a CHL class, another was just other day)
So it didn't make it feel like a whole new pistol or anything, after puttin it in I feel the pistol is just that much better then before, and because the two things we are talking about (recoil springs, your slide not locking open) seem intertwined.

Let's say you go this route with a decent place you can return if not 100% happy. You not only replace yucky plastic guide spring rod, you fix the slide open lock, and reduce felt and real recoil by "up to 8%" which is what they claim. Then to myself, it would be maybe worth a try, of course I suppose they'd have to take it back after firing it and using it, but how else would one know if indeed it worked anyway?

So, again, if gibberish, I apologize for wasting your time OP, and someone here might very well chime in a give reasons why i am wrong.
 

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Just recently started reloading and have been working 6-7 different powders making 10 rounds each of each powder and testing them. My initial loads were all very very week yet they still locked back fine. The OP stated this happens with a heavier load as well.

Are the calipers you're using to measure OAL reading correctly? Perhaps the bullet isn't seating enough. Riding the slide is a possibility as Sun mentioned also. Different loads could have you subconsciously gripping the gun slightly different. Have any copper bullets to load and try?

I can't see this being a Lead bullet issue especially since its across 3 different bullets.

Btw.. Welcome to the forums avenell :)
 

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I'm not saying anything bad about the DPS recoil reduction system however there is nothing wrong with the plastic guide rods. These are used in almost every polymer handgun on the market and are incredibly durable with an extremely low rate of failure. I know, as I had a defective one in my first PPQ, talked to S&W and Walther and spent hours researching them online and it really is a non issue. If you want to buy an aftermarket recoil reduction system that's fine but don't buy one simply to replace the plastic guide rod as, simply put.. Its a complete waste of your money.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Hello All,

Thanks for the quick replies and the welcome!

1. I am looking into the Red Spring with the Aussie importer for Walther, but haven't heard back. Thanks for that lead!

2. I'm very confident it's not me riding the slide. This gun is shared between four people, and has been passed around like a parcel because everyone wants to try it. When we were shooting factory, everything locked it back. Now we're loading our own, nothing locks it back. That includes my first 100 rounds which were 147gn JHPs. We've put a good 2-3k worth of reloads through it, no lockback at all. Cheers for the suggestion though, everything is worth looking at!

3. Sim - because I want to use this for IPSC Production division I can't use any recoil reduction kits. Otherwise I would be tempted!

4. Adrenolin - I have tried 100 x 147gn JHP's, and the only fault I could find with em was that they wouldn't lock the slide back either. Does OAL have that much effect on slides locking back? I understand deeper seating = more pressure = more recoil, and that running it out too long can cause feeding and chambering issues, but will it effect lock back? I could try pushing them further into the case and seeing what happens?

This one is still a puzzler! I'm not reading heaps of people with the same issue, so I'm starting to wonder...

Cheers,

Jba
 

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I don't think it was a reliability issue. I'm pretty sure he just wanted more weight/recoil mitigation.
Heck if it's more weight he wants.....just grab a tac light, remove battery, insert chunk of lead, install on pistol.:D Or, install 1" tube, 'light holder', as used on assault rifles and instead of a 1" light, use a 1" round piece of steel or brass or lead or ??? ......... you can fine tune the weight to your liking.
 

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How many factory loads have you shot? Try loading the last round (first in) with a factory one and going through a bunch of mags to ensure it isn't you on those stupid oversized PPQ slide levers.

I have used clays and it works but yeah, it is not a good choice for 9mm. I don't recall the charge but to get it to cycle reliably it was toward the upper end. Never had an issue with the Walther but an M9 I have didn't run well on it at all.
 

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Any chance you're using the same magazine(s) with your factory loads, and a different one(s) for your reloads? May be a mag issue, if so.

I've shot down to powderpuff loads around 115PF w/out issue, although that's in range of the threshold for my gun not wanting to cycle fully or stove-piping (~111PF, I have a few 115PF loads that are quite fine).

Here's some load data w/chrono results..
http://i.imgur.com/801ENxC.png
 

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I'm not saying anything bad about the DPS recoil reduction system however there is nothing wrong with the plastic guide rods. These are used in almost every polymer handgun on the market and are incredibly durable with an extremely low rate of failure. I know, as I had a defective one in my first PPQ, talked to S&W and Walther and spent hours researching them online and it really is a non issue. If you want to buy an aftermarket recoil reduction system that's fine but don't buy one simply to replace the plastic guide rod as, simply put.. Its a complete waste of your money.
I never once said, and u know, if I'm wrong I apologize, but I never said For OP to buy a DPS or "recoil reduction system" to replace the guide rod, because it's plastic. And again, almost 100% positive I didn't say that's why I purchased my R.R.S. I did however say it could be looked at as a "Win" due to the exact problem you've already encountered. They break.

I am sure it was a cost thing for Walther, and it's failure rate may be relatively low, I bet money it's higher failure rate then the almost zero in metal guide rods, but a slight weight advantage, (but here it's actually needed right under barrel in a poly frame) and cost, it's considered low enough for Us Walther PPQ guys to trust their lives with it, I do, but I don't have a plastic guide rod either lol, really,

When it comes to replacing the rod a lot of guys might be leaving them in, or maybe range shooters are and CCW guys and LEOs replace them a lot? Then finally this, as I didn't just buy an actual Steel or stainless steel rod, but instead I've introduced a mechanical function (in the form of a spring piston which the round inside piece bottoms out) and like your plastic, my "device" would not be a reliable as a steel rod, right? So, I've actually traded one potential problem for another, and I'm the one to point it out! (Only cause one of you savvy thinkers prolly woulda thought about it for a second and you'd have same conclusion)



I digress anyway, OP said he can't use any after market or "enhancements" really what it would be, so, the idea process on my whole point is/was useless.

So, to each his own, I explained where a reviewer mentioned the heavy recoil, which I claimed any poly framed short barrel will have a rather "snappy" recoil anyway, just by the sheer physics of the weight minus the metal frame, these guns have a rather hefty recoil. It was a personal decision to get the RRS

I can't even see how you jumped to the conclusion you did. I am sure I mentioned it as a plus, and certainly not the best, or only reason to get a RRS

So, it was only a thought to help fix the OPs problem, it wasn't to "bash" your PPQ or anyone else's. For all you who haven't even thought of replacing them, and don't intend to give it any thought.

Good luck OP, let us know what You find out and what fixes it.
Gute Jagd
 

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I see Avenell, well, that kinda kills my idea , not that it was the best one or if it would even work, I guess without mentioning it though, we wouldn't have known that was/is a no go.
I'm sure some of these re-loaders can hopefully help you, but it's sounding like the reloading isn't the problem (to me, but I am not an expert by any stretch) by the way did you actually physically look at the tiny part that "locks" the slide back and just to see if it didn't get prematurely worn or broken or something? This could be an idiotic statement due to the simplicity of it, but it's possible I suppose that something like that might have happened. It's like the guide spring thing, sure I believe most will not have an issue, but everything can go bad once in a while, maybe it's a mechanical adjustment or something got bent?? You say it's passed around? Hopefully to people that would treat it as their own?
So, as to not waste anymore of your time, I'll just read the outcome from here on out, good
Luck!
 
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