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Discussion Starter #1
I took my P99 (1st gen) to the range this morning and after about 20 rounds experienced a failure to fire. Trigger would retract but striker would not fire.

Eventually stripped it and found that a piece of the polymer fire control assembly block had cracked off and the trigger bar guide rod had fallen out. Without the trigger bar guide in place the pistol is essentially rendered inoperative.



Q1: does the trigger bar guide form part of the fire control assembly block? (It seems to but my aging eyes are struggling to make out what's part of the frame and what's part of the block )

Q2: can the fire control assembly block be replaced or is it formed as part of the polymer frame?

If no to the above then I presume the entire frame will have to be replaced?

For the record I shoot 122gr SWC lead in IDPA matches, the loads are carefully constructed and chronographed to just make power factor, so no, I'm not blasting away with +P+ loads. The pistol has had about 3,600 rounds through it.

cheers
andy
 

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The fire control assembly can be replaced. I had to have mine replaced on my pistol several years ago.
 

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I'll wait to see your update rather than commenting after our phone conversation. But just for the benefit of others, this also happened to me, and I"ve commented on another thread about it in more detail. Thanks for doing the research.... the photos are good, mine broke in precisely the same spot.
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
OK so my take on this is that it's one amazing co-incidence that two virtually identical firearms (a 9mm and a .40, both gen.1) bought round about the same time experience an identical failure. my best guess is that the recoil spring starts to weaken, allowing the slide to start hammering the frame harder and harder, and then eventually something snaps. ( http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=78837&highlight=P99+recoil )

This is most unfortunate as this is my self defence firearm, and after this experience my confidence in the weapon is severely shaken. Nowhere in the manual does it state how often parts may wear and when they should be replaced. Hopefully my gunsmith can source a replacement fire control assembly but this may be a problem as the Walther agents in South Africa changed recently with all the bad service that implies, and shipping any firearm parts to South Africa from the US or direct from Walther is extremely problematic due to US ITAR and German export regulations.

:-(
 

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I'm sorry to hear that IdleLayabout and Slowhand99; I've read your posts in this thread as well as the "Has anyone had to replace parts..." thread. I don't believe this a common occurrence, but I understand it is not an inspiring one.

I inspected my first generation P99 earlier this morning, and found a significant amount of plastic fore of the pin. I would be surprised if it broke off suddenly. I'll post a picture if anyone wants to compare.

I wish you luck in repairing your firearms.
 

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I would say this is not only common, but expected. If you look at my attached photo the frames are, from left to right, Gen 1 P99, Gen 3 P99, PPQ. Notice the fire control assembly. The Gen 3 and PPQ are angled on the outside edge. The Gen 1 is square, and as you will notice, there is a small crack on the outside of the pin and the forward portion is slightly bent inward. This appears to be a stress area on the Gen 1 models which required Walther to do a very slight redesign.
Notice also the wear mark at the rear of the block next to the back of the spring indicating where the extractor retention pin stops when the slide is blown back. On the Gen 3 and PPQ there are indentations for the extractor retention pin to rest (see more info in the post below).

 

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The extractor retention pin (seen in the images to the left of the barrel chamber...and forgive me if I called it the wrong name) is impacting the block and then rides up on top of it for almost 3/4" every time the gun fires. This pin is on a spring. You should be able to press it into the frame effortlessly. If it gets very dirty or is not lubricated (through the hole on the top of the slide) and becomes siezed, it will impact that portion of the block without giving as it should. The crack was present on mine when I bought it (used) but I am very careful to keep my firearms clean and lubed. It hasn't gotten any worse in the five years I have owned and shot it.

 

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I would say this is not only common, but expected. If you look at my attached photo the frames are, from left to right, Gen 1 P99, Gen 3 P99, PPQ. Notice the fire control assembly. The Gen 3 and PPQ are angled on the outside edge. The Gen 1 is square, and as you will notice, there is a small crack on the outside of the pin and the forward portion is slightly bent inward. This appears to be a stress area on the Gen 1 models which required Walther to do a very slight redesign.
Iron Man, I appreciate the correction; information such as this is precisely why I visit this forum. After your first post I disassembled my P99 to understand the function first hand, and concluded I should provide a little lubrication to the contact area in addition to inspection ever so often.

I now wonder of the interchangeability of fire control assemblies between the generations. I currently would presume it possible?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Hi guys, thanks for the constructive feedback. Ironman, the pics are very informative. Note also on the right hand Gen 3 that the trigger bar guide is completely redesigned. Instead of a pin it's now an arm resting against the frame underneath the fire control unit (also called the sear housing). Not sure about the centre Gen 3, I can see a pin and also what looks like an arm.

In the newer diagrams the trigger bar guide (part 17) is now absent and the new part 32.8 called an adjustable trigger bar guide has taken its place. On the DAO model it's called the disconnecter. Diagrams here courtesy of Jonm61: http://www.waltherforums.com/forum/faq-p99/17885-p99-compact-illustrated-parts-list.html

Slowhand's gun is now repaired, I'm hoping to have a new sear housing within 24 hours. We're also both getting new recoil springs. Additionally I'm considering buying yet another sear housing and recoil spring to keep on hand for future replacement. I'll report back on the repair.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Finally fetched the gun from the shop today, new fire control unit and new recoil spring. The new fire control units come with an adjustable trigger bar guide which won't fit in my P99. Good thing I didn't lose the trigger guide bar. Will take it to the range with my chronograph this weekend and report back.
 

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Good info.

I never really noticed the little gouge next to the spring, but there it is. No cracks in my block though.

Since buying my P99 nine years ago, I've pretty much always kept that extractor pin well lubed, not really knowing what it specifically did, but just recognizing it as a moving part.

Glad it turned out okay for you folks!
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Took the P99 to the range today and happily everything seems fine. Some smokestacks from old reloads (new recoil spring a bit stiffer) but new reloads worked 100% and very consistent over the chronograph.

Some observations; the new sear housing has the Gen 3 trigger bar guide 'housing' with the bevelled edge. The sear housing comes with an adjustable trigger bar guide which in my model is not used.




Something else I noticed was the old recoil guide bar sticks out quite a bit whereas the new one is flush with the front of the slide. I can't recall if it was like this originally when I got it or if this is evidence of the recoil spring weakening. After 200 rounds I stripped it and noticed some small metal shavings, possibly from the edges of the new recoil spring wearing in.



Hopefully this is the end of the drama and the thread proves useful to others, thanks to all those that contributed advice.
 

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I had this problem maybe 3 years ago and when I called on the part (the sear block housing only, not including the small control parts that fit in it), I was told it would be like $114. I let my P99 sit for several months non-functional and tried again where I got some number of like $80 maybe from Earl's and $11 from S&W. I have no idea why these numbers were so far apart, but you can pretty much guess where I ordered the replacement sear block from. I was very clear over the phone to each party that I was looking for the plastic housing block only, without the control parts included.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
My sear housing, including all the little internal springs and stuff came to R495.00 (south african) which translates to about $50. However these were old stock sitting at Truvelo in Pretoria. For comparison the recoil springs were R75 each, about $8.
 

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Hi guys just saw the post about fire control assembly. I bought mine in 2000. I shot IDPA with it till the ejector sheared off. It's part of the sear assembly block. Does anyone know who carries it or where I can get it fixed? Is a S&W99 interchageble?
 
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