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Discussion Starter #1
Okay I have 2 P99's & 2 P22's...now I need a rifle that I can have fun with out in the woods and the range...I thought of the G22 but was also thinking of something that could serve more as home defense too...any ideas...SKS, Mini-14, AK
...something that I could feed cheaply and have fun with too..
 

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AK's and SKS's are cheap and fun. I have a WASR-10 (romainian AK) which is the cheapest incarnation of the AK, and it's a hoot to shoot and totally reliable. Not the best in the accuracy department (I'd wager it's 4-6 MOA), but then again that's me without a bench. It's ugly as sin too, but for $300 it's alot of gun.

SKS would probably be more accurate, stripper clips work great.

I'd stear clear of the mini 14, accuracy isn't much if any better than an AK, and it's way more expensive and way less reliable. I've only shot one in my day, but it was by far the weakest perfoming rifle I've handled to date. On a positive note though, Ruger is now selling factory 20rnd mags to civilians, so maybe it's not so bad now, but it's still $200 more than the next cheapest option (AK).
 

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I think that Keltec folding carbine seems pretty cool. U can get one to take Glock mags. I've been researching it recently and I am tempted...
 

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I agree with the Kel Tec. I have been wanting to shoot one because I have only heard good things about them, that and they are really cheap to shoot. You can choose between 9mm and 40. and also the type of clips they use. They also have one that shoots .223 (AR 15 ammo?). They are supposed to be farily reliable too. Does anyone here have any personal experience with one.??
Patrick
 

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You didn't say what calibers your P-99's were.....but the Beretta Storm has you coverd no matter.

I have the .40 caliber Storm to go along with my .40 P-99.
This carbine is very cost effective and you can add as many accessories as you like. I have a Red Dot scope mounted on mine as well as a tactical LED T-3 Invoa flashlight. I also installed a forearm verticle (short) grip on mine. It is a great home defense gun for many reasons......but the best reason is that women love to shoot this gun and are very good with it. Low recoil........low sound levels......and a natural point and shoot ability. This is the most fun gun that I take to the "indoor" range to shoot. I like the idea of buying a thousand round case of .40 cal ammo and I am set for both the carbine and P-99 for practice. $600 for the Storm and another $100 or so for the accessories.

http://www.pbase.com/blackbeard350/beretta_storm

Cut and paste the above to your broswer for a look see at my Storm

JF
 

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if you want to go cheap try the hi-points, for a cheap gun they shoot pretty good and accurate but you only get a 10 round clip.
 

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Buds gun shop has the hi-point 9mm for 127.00 and extra clips are 14.23each. Really go to the hi-point webb site and read what there customers say about there guns, for a plinker or a straight shooter you cant beat it.
 

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Didn't say what you were looking for in a rifle, the Highpoint if you want a pistol caliber carbine to interchange ammo with. If you want just a plinker, I love my AKT-98. It's a Romanian AK-47 training rifle chambered in .22LR. It's a blast to shoot, built on a true AK reciver so folding stock and all the other nice accesories fit properly. And it comes in black poly furniture so it'll match the Wally. For just a cheap varment rifle I've got a Rem 700 in 5.56/.223, which cost, brand new, $130. I threw an $80 BSA 8-32x scope on it and can shoot touching holes at 200 yards. For longer range and semi-auto I've got a PSL, which is a Romanian rifle built on a long AK action, resembeling a Dragunov and chambered in 7.62x54R. So far I've been getting 3/4 MOA with it and the surplus ammo has been running 9 cents a round. For no holds barred stopping power, and to really turn heads at the range, an AR-50's hard to beat. Bolt action, .50 BMG, $1/shot but it's a BLAST. Muzle break is really efficent to it dosen't kick, rather shoves. $1200 for the rifle though. Been shooting 1/2" steel plate scraps rather than paper for fun with that one.
 

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Get an assault rifle like a Colt AR-15 or maybe a knock off like bushmaster or rock river arms.

AR-15's are completely reliable, extremely accurate, but not too cheap if you buy a good one.

I have a Colt M4A3 with a mounted laser and an EoTech Holographic site...its my favorite rifle for sure.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Sniper350,
That is one fine looking Beretta Storm...honestly I hadn't thought about that route. I may have to look into it. I have 2 9mm's and was looking for a home defense-plinking rifle. I thought of an SKS or AR because of the ammo factor. Still leaning this way but the Storm makes me curious. I wonder why Walther doesn't go this route? Wasn't the G22 out about the same time as the Storm? Besides its not like Umarex couldn't afford to tool up for this project. Just look at the changes they've made in the 99 in the last few years...
 

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I belong to the Beretta forum, and I have thought about the storm. There are a lot of Storm owners there, and I started some threads about using this gun for home defense. While most loved the gun, the consensus was that there was enough part breakages to avoid it for defensive use for now. Not enough of the bugs have been worked out.

That's why I am leaning towards the Keltec folding carbine. Only $300 too.
 

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If you want to go with an AR-15, I think Olyimpic is the one to go with. They're one of the few manufacturers that make their own recivers. Personally I like the AR-10 better because the .308 is a much better round. A friend and I did the math and a 5.56 would have almost identical terminal balistics as a .45 at close range, but a .45 would be alot quieter for home defense. No reason you need to go deaf saving your own life. The .308 or 7.62x54R are very much stomping rounds. They hit hard enough to cause shock to the nervous system which is more likley to stun the attacker long enough for them to become incapacitated.
 

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if i want better close range ballistics with the 5.56 mm round in my Colt M4, i use hollow point. it destroys anything soft it hits. period. and i can still get head shots pretty easily at 200 yards with open sights. 5.56 mm has a very flat trajectory and is a really accurate round. the AR-10 uses 7.62x39 mm, the same as the AK-47, which isn't really that much larger of a round, and has a much less flat trajectory. now the 7.62x51 mm is another story. that is the real .308 sniper round. it kicks a$$ but mainly in longer range bolt action rifles.

but like i said, if you want a really really fun, ergonomic, and accurate gun, the AR-15 is the best. ergonomics is key. on an AR-15, all of the functions can be controlled with your trigger hand or without any major change to your grip. the trigger safety can be manipulated with the thumb of your trigger hand, the mag release can be pressed with your trigger finger, and the slide release can be slammed with your stalk hand.

get an AR-15...you won't regret it. if you want the best, buy Colt, but the other companies make great products too. it's a sexy looking rifle too.

You can also get a drop in 9mm upper receiver for the AR-15 too. which is awesome.
 

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Ah no, my brother has an DPMS AR-10 and it's chambered in .308/7.62x51 NATO. The 7.62x39 isn't much more round than a 5.56, but it does make a bigger hole, especially at close range. Out of a 14.5" barreled rifle, the 5.56 isn't much better than a .22 Mag. Now, 6.8SPC on the other hand...
 

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The Beretta Storm is a very nice, very short, very light pistol caliber carbine. However, IMHO, pistol caliber carbines are an answer to a question nobody asked (again, IMHO).

I PERSONALLY own an AK built from a polish parts kit. 7.62x39 is good out to ~350 yard, and I made the decision that where I live, that is enough. If you live on rolling hills of pasture or something, by all means porcure something in 7.62x51 (be it CETME, FAL, G3, VEPR, etc). Again, I PERSONALLY do not consider the AR-15 reliable enough to own as the rifle that I might have to drag around on foot for an unknown number of days/weeks/months if something truely bad ever happened in this country.

YMMV
 

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ah ok...i really thought the AR-10 used 7.62x39 like the AK. but go on ar-15.com...there are some good testaments to the reliability of the ar-15. they can take a lot of abuse...i've got a lot of friends in the marines and they say they put their rifles through hell and they keep going. but the AK is a great rifle too...just not quite sexy enough to go with the sexy P99.
 

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I've got a couple of pretty sexy AK's...

The big one is a PSL, a Romanian battle rifle chambered in 7.62x54R. It's got a PSO-1 scope on it.

The other one's my .22LR plinker, also a Romanian, AKT-98, with a red dot, a laser, and a folding stock. The laser's there so I don't have to sight down the rifle for every shot.
 

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JakeStarr,
The 9mm Storm is the perfect plinking carbine and well suited for Home defense. That is if you consider any of the Pistols you might carry adequate for the job.........we are talking about a pistol cartridge. If you listen to claims that the Storm's power is not sufficient......then you must believe that all Walthers can't do the job either. The question was "home defense" and not Survival in the "wild".

Why a carbine that fires pistol rounds ? Accuracy is the number one answer.........almost anyone can pick up a Storm and do very well at distances out to 50 yds. Women, little girls and of course men seem to be able to hit their targets with ease.

Parts breakage : Except for some minor problems with the extractor in some Storms , I know of no problems with reliability. It was never really proven if the problem was poor cleaning habits causing the extractor breakage or defective design...........but even that problem is gone> I too belong to the Beretta Forum and have not read any posts lately complaining of defective parts. In the beginning, there was also a minor issue with the magazine lock.......but I have never seen it in my Storm.

Training: The most important aspect of any firearm usage. The Storm can be taken to most, if not all, Indoor Ranges and shot. This fact alone makes it easier to practice with this firearm--- for most of us that don't live in remote or rural areas. It is sometimes easier to get the wife to go to a nice indoor range to receive practice and training............then to get them to go out into the woods somewhere or an outdoor rifle range.

My go-to home defense weapon is my .40 cal Storm........because it is effective at room size distances.....and if I have to........I can, with very little effort, reach out and touch you at 50 yds away.
My back up is a S&W mod. 696 .44 Spl. 3"bbl shooting 200 gr. Silver Tips.

JF
 
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