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Old 02-04-2016, 09:24 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by 1917-1911M View Post
I'd like the explanation for where you guys are going with this. Why the mainspring? Hammer bouncing, not rebounding fast enough, what? M1911
Well, it warrants checking, just like a bunch of other things, including the tightness of the sear rivets. No telling what you'll find. Something is going on --either marginally all the time or intermittently--that is compromising a secure, consistent engagement of the hammer nose with the sear. A hammer nose that is too long or too short can cause problems, especially if the pivot holes in the frame are "out" by just a little.

Sometimes the easy way to diagnose the cause is to remove the springs and manipulate the parts by hand, searching by feel. If that fails, start substituting parts one at a time until it feels different. It helps to have a handful of extra hammers to choose from.

Locating the problem is indeed how good gunsmiths earn their living.

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Old 02-04-2016, 10:07 AM   #12
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MG, interesting but does it say anything on your thread about the chance of the recoil spring small end not being slide first over the barrel? I know both my original and the one Milspec sent to me do not have a small end but in my manual still refers to it.
Lot of sorry ammo out there due to dooms day hoarders (HA) and if the pistol is second hand, no telling what has been done to it. Not a clue why someone would attempt to lighten the trigger pull on a PPK/S. Guess they think it's a target pistol?
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I have a PPK/S for a pretty paper weight. If I need a real gun, I grab the RPG-7 loaded with a OG-7V..
If I am down to a pistol, let it be my S&W Model 19 with my Model 92F with 15 round magazines as a backup.
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Old 02-04-2016, 10:39 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by 1917-1911M View Post
I'd like the explanation for where you guys are going with this. Why the mainspring? Hammer bouncing, not rebounding fast enough, what? M1911
You never did tell us in the other thread (https://www.waltherforums.com/forum/f...s-specs-4.html) whether you kept the appointment with Mike McClellan, and what if anything he found.

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Old 02-04-2016, 10:47 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by RIPSAW View Post
... about the chance of the recoil spring small end not being slide first over the barrel? I know both my original and the one Milspec sent to me do not have a small end but in my manual still refers to it.
... if the pistol is second hand, no telling what has been done to it. Not a clue why someone would attempt to lighten the trigger pull on a PPK/S. Guess they think it's a target pistol?
Every original Walther, Manurhin and Ranger recoil spring I have ever seen has a reduced diameter end at the rear. To go smoothly on the barrel, one usually needs to torque the spring slightly, in the opposite direction of the twist, in order to expand the coil. I don't know about S&W or Wolff replacements.

I cannot account for the fact that yours do not.

As for clipping the hammer spring, note that I wrote the "DA" pull.

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Old 02-04-2016, 11:21 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by 1917-1911M View Post
I found that the problem on my pistol was something I would have never been able to determine by careful visual inspection, wear inspection, even using a micrometer to measure old parts vs new. ...
Just curious:did you ever try removing the DA dog from the hammer and shooting the gun without it?

In the other thread you posted a photo of two hammers with the dogs in considerably different "at rest" positions. They can't both be right.

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Old 02-04-2016, 06:17 PM   #16
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MG, I talked to Mike and was going to stop by but the replacement hammer block spring someone sent me solved the issue. That pistol has been fired a 1,000 times or more since and is a favorite with everyone. I have had no further issues with it. No one has managed to borrow it either....like some of my other pistols.

At the time it seemed like Mike was recovering from some accident and was behind but the next time I'm in the area I intend to stop in just to say hello. Seemed like a very nice guy on the phone. He is about 90 miles north of me.

The second hammer was not used....as you may recall...the foot of the original appeared to be in good shape. I put the second hammer in and I would have to read the thread again to see if I made a comment on it but I don't think it fit properly. I still have it but am not using it. The replacement ejector spring fit like a glove too. Let me look back in that thread and see what I said. Long and rambling thing it was but.....the issue was resolved.

One odd thing I remember and something I might still have Mike look at is that for some reason I remember really gripping the pistol very hard and holding the trigger back really hard and that was causing some problems even after the new spring was installed. After relaxing my grip and trigger pressure to a normal firm grip and pull......everything worked 100% and I haven't had even one failure since counting a wide variety of shooters. M1911
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Old 02-04-2016, 07:43 PM   #17
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I took another look at that thread.


Quote:
The new hammer did not fit against the hammer strut properly, the front edge of the DA cocking lever was rough and could be felt dragging along the edge of the sear. It also was not adjusted properly for this pistol and would slip off the rear of the sear in DA.

I have a death grip on the pistol and was pulling the trigger back with the first joint of my trigger finger. Pulling it back hard. I noticed when I did this that operating the slide would become fairly difficult when it came to the slide disconnecting the trigger bar from the sear. So, I placed the tip of my trigger finger on the trigger and the slide operated much easier when encountering the disconnect appendage. Then I put the grips back on, loosened up on the death grip, used the tip of my trigger finger and in 20 rounds didn't have any issues.

Could holding back too hard on the trigger cause the problems I am having. When using the tip of my finger and firing I could actually feel the trigger bumping back a little as the slide operated.

I'm not sure that first para is a good description of what was going on...but the hammer didn't work.

The above seems to have been as far as I got with it. After I quit holding the trigger back really hard...everything fell into place and the pistol functioned 100%. This was not the original case...I did not begin shooting with the trigger pulled back hard. Normal firm grip, normal trigger pull. And, now that I look back at the pictures of the new spring vs the old hammer block spring. The new spring is longer and much more robust. I don't think the two springs are the same. Apparently the pistol had the wrong spring installed. You never know what you might get with a used pistol.....but thanks to the advice received from Members here....we solved it....that and some new parts from a Member. If I get up Mike's way I will carry the pistol up and let him look it over. M1911
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Old 02-04-2016, 08:45 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by MGMike View Post
Just curious:did you ever try removing the DA dog from the hammer and shooting the gun without it? M
I didn't... I believe that was the part that was causing trouble with hammer #2 and it certainly did sit differently from the one on the original hammer. I don't remember clearly but I think DA didn't work with the new hammer installed. I don't think I ever fired the pistol with the second hammer installed. I probably dry fired it, cocked it manually and at one point after reinstalling the original hammer though the second one might have benefited something. In the end I think the spring was the issue and I was causing a problem by holding the trigger back too hard. I forget now why I was even doing that. I'm not sure if that should be possible but if I remember correctly hooking my finger over the trigger so I could really hold it back after releasing the hammer made something hang up, drag along, something I could feel. I'm not sure what....but as soon as I let up on the trigger pull and resumed what would be normal operation of the trigger I never had any more issues.. This was after the new spring was installed.

I guess removing the dog leg strut would have taken one potential problem part out of the equation. The second hammer might work well without it. I never attempted to adjust the position of the dog leg on the second hammer. I could make it match the original hammer I expect but the "why and what this would accomplish" is beyond my knowledge. I might drop the second hammer with the leg removed in it the next time I take it down that far and see how it fires and cocks. M1911
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Old 02-05-2016, 08:15 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by 1917-1911M View Post
...

One odd thing I remember ... really gripping the pistol very hard and holding the trigger back really hard and that was causing some problems even after the new spring was installed. After relaxing my grip and trigger pressure to a normal firm grip and pull......
I think the new spring treated the symptom but not the cause. The gun had a marginal condition that resulted from some binding somewhere, and the new spring provided enough oomph to overcome it -- at least until you took all the slop out with a very tight grip. When the gun is properly fitted, it shouldn't matter how tight you are holding back the trigger.

The DA dog is designed to slip off the horizontal bar of the sear well before the hammer and sear lock together for SA operation. If it doesn't, or if it's late, or causes some post-release drag, that may account for the malfunction. Anyway, that's why I suggested removing it to narrow the diagnosis.

But I'd let Mike McClellan run his discerning eye and sensitive fingers over it.

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