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Old 12-12-2013, 12:04 PM   #11
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MGMike .38
I will toss in two cents worth:

All that the Violence Policy Center did --13 years ago-- was to collate the available annual manufacturers' reports to BATF from 1975 (at the earliest) to 1998. At that time (2000) it represented a 2-year-old snapshot of the firearms industry, which VPC wanted to exploit for its own political propaganda. It is now ancient history, and its usefulness, even back in 2000, is difficult to fathom. It is of no significance to the composition of the industry or its production today, 15 years later.

As far as it goes, the data is reasonably reliable, having been originally assembled by BATF for federal excise tax accounting. But there are some gaping and unexplained omissions, such as the absence of pre-1986 figures for Ruger, Remington, Colt's and U.S. Repeating Arms, among others. In any event the figures relate to domestic production; they do not include imports.

Many of the manufacturers are listed by unfamiliar corporate names, or by more than one name, according to how the annual manufacturing license was applied for. Emco and Ranger are a good example. Their totals must be added together to get a picture of production for Interarms. 1998 coincidentally was the last year of deliveries to Interarms.

The .380 pistols are all either PPK/s or PPK, blue or stainless, totaling 277,428. The .32s add another 5,031.

The .22s listed are all TPH, stainless or blue, totaling 32,340*. TPH .25s add 620 units.

It is not known whether these figures include rejects returned by Interarms that were subsequently scrapped by the manufacturer.

The figures show pretty clearly that there was no serial production of PPK/s pistols before 1980, and not much in that year. Initial production was blue, and did not get rolling until 1981; stainless did not start until about 1983. TPHs were introduced, first in stainless, about 1987.

All of this illustrates the pitfalls of trying to extrapolate production totals or year of manufacture from observed serial numbers; basically it doesn't work.

I rather wish VPC would update this study to 2012. The results would be very interesting, and I can't see how it would be injurious to us. The BATF data is in the public domain, but the compilation itself is a lot of work. Why not let our enemies waste their money and energy doing it?

M

Last edited by MGMike; 12-12-2013 at 05:58 PM. Reason: *Corrected total for .22 TPH; see below.
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Old 12-12-2013, 01:27 PM   #12
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gene 1 .22
Great posts by both Mike & Submoa. I was only thinking of 32 PPK & PPK/S. I knew production on 380's did go on after 1988. At least it was a list of Ranger production up to 1988.
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Old 12-12-2013, 02:06 PM   #13
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Kool Mike thanks as well .

So there were really that many TPH .22s...and actually that few TPH .25s huh?

Oh wait...don't forget the 8740 TPH .22s from the '86-'88 Ranger chart. They should be added to your 23870 total right? That'd make the TPH .22 numbers even higher @ 32610 and the ratio of .22s v. .25s even greater.

Wow, where'd all those things go?
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Old 12-12-2013, 05:56 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sub-moa View Post
...

Oh wait...don't forget the 8740 TPH .22s from the '86-'88 Ranger chart. They should be added to your 23870 total right? That'd make the TPH .22 numbers even higher @ 32610 and the ratio of .22s v. .25s even greater.

...
My mistake. The correct total of .22 TPH would be 32,340. The overwhelming majority of those were stainless.

M

Last edited by MGMike; 12-12-2013 at 06:27 PM. Reason: Note: Ranger reported 8,470, not 8,740.
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Old 12-12-2013, 06:19 PM   #15
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Thanks again Mike

Guess I need to find me one

Never should have let my Ulm Lwt go
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Old 12-12-2013, 06:38 PM   #16
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Nice job, guys. The information here is too good to let slip off into gradually disappearing thread mode, only to be resurrected three years from by some newcomer hoping to get a bead on what grandpa left him -- at which point he is promptly chided for necromancy and is never heard from again.
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Old 12-13-2013, 09:29 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MGMike View Post
My mistake. The correct total of .22 TPH would be 32,340. The overwhelming majority of those were stainless.

M
Dyslexia...or at least fumble fingers , strikes again , re: 8470 v. 8740. I'd jotted down the '86-'88 total 8470 correctly on a piece of scratch paper, then rounded it to "8.5K" in my OP...as I'd rounded all OP totals. BUT , later transposed the numbers when adding/typing the subsequent response to Mike . DUH...sorry .

While we're at it...and muddying this up ...couldn't "Edit" once it was a "Sticky" I guess: "5." of my OP should read "blue and stainless USA made pistols from 1980 to 1990", I do have "a few" other PP series pistols from across the pond .

AND, of course: Thanks Searcher
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Last edited by sub-moa; 12-13-2013 at 09:31 AM. Reason: No more math, just the "Thanks"...
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Old 12-13-2013, 10:37 AM   #18
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Something's up in the software regarding editing posts right now; it's been reported, so hang on ... sorry about that.

Good information here, guys. Nicely done. All current and future Ranger/Interams owners will appreciate it.
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Old 12-16-2013, 04:00 PM   #19
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Here is one that I found from it's Test firing A079656 29 Jan 95.
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Old 02-18-2014, 03:36 PM   #20
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From a post on GB -

A SS IA PPK/S .380 with Ser # S065326, test target date 9/27/89.

Last edited by Milspec; 10-09-2015 at 03:38 PM.
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