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Old 05-11-2015, 12:47 PM   #11
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WobbleWalt, you really have no arguments from me regarding the whole point of your concerns. My concerns start with the fact that the pistol has proven unreliable to many owners. That alone makes it a no go for me. Walther or any other manufacture. I'm in full agreement that I don't like this situation. Plenty of firearms can fire if the firing pin gets jammed for whatever reason. A whatever reason for the CCP might be a broken striker spring that jams the striker fully forward. It might be slippage off the firing pin safety or dues to a short stroke of the slide, ammo or owner error...But, before anything can really get done some issues will have to demonstrate that the pistol can fire. That is the intent of 50 drops on the same round. If 50 won't set one off it is unlikely that one strike will unless the striker is bound up somehow.....which could occur. That is the point of my suggested test. I'm not sure what Walther does I'd feel more confident if I could not make a round fire after 50 or 100 test, each trying to indent the primer more than the previous. If I get my hands on one of these I will test that 50 or 100 times. It won't hurt the pistol and I will treat it as if it is going to fire at any time. If I can't make several varieties of ammo fire....I'd be less concerned about the striker following the slide forward.

Now disabling the sear and drop safety and pulling the striker rear ward, releasing it and I would expect the striker to fire a round. It would be interesting to see just how far back the striker needs to be pulled to do this also. 1/2 the distance, 3/4???? I hear your concerns....ha! Getting something done about it is another issue and in my opinion will take an entire redesign of the rear of the pistol. M1911
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Old 05-11-2015, 12:51 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WobblyWalt View Post

When it happens, the striker is protruding from the breech face and will hit the primer while chambering a round and then push against the primer with the measured force of 0.6 kg. Some users reported that there are visible marks on the primers when this happens.
I've sort of been following this thread with a little interest.

I'd argue that a primer with visible marks on it isn't exactly uncommon.

I've had a few guns I've chambered a round in, carried all day, and unloaded at night to find a small mark on the primer.

All primers are different brand to brand, but they all require some force to actually ignite.
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Old 05-11-2015, 02:50 PM   #13
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There is a problem in this tread and the video. When striker is cocked by hand with the slide removed and assuming that the striker safety fails the striker would ignite the primer but when slide is installed on the frame back of the striker spring is compressed from the rear so there in constant tension on firing pin and when slide moves forward the tension is released from the back and is building on the front cocking the striker. So there is no possibility of dangerous situation. Look at the striker channel when slide is pulled back; there is no spring there. I can be wrong of course.
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Old 05-11-2015, 03:45 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by Lotsglocks View Post
So there is no possibility of dangerous situation.
Lots....the issue is not when the striker is cocked and held by the sear. It's when the striker fails to cock, is not held by the sear and is full forward with the firing pin exposed as the slide travels forward to battery. The striker safety is not and will not trap the striker and prevent a possible discharge.
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Old 05-11-2015, 05:36 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by 1917-1911M View Post
..Can you make yours fire a round under any of the scenarios you present?...
Have we not seen one person report about seeing dented priimers?

Remington had the same arguments as you in court, in front of a jury, and lost.
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Old 05-11-2015, 07:37 PM   #16
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I've forgotten what I once knew about the Remington safety release issue. We have one so at one time I checked into this pretty carefully. I don't think the issue with the Remington 700 is anywhere close to what we are discussing with the Walther CCP. We have a concern about the CCP, but, does the pistol actually have a safety issue? I'm not sure. If the striker follows the slide forward it appears the striker although spring loaded does not have enough energy to indent a primer. If the slide is short stroked where the striker isn't caught but a round is chambered the firing pin will be resting against the primer of a chambered round. Will dropping the pistol fire a round? I don't know. Perhaps the mass of the striker is too little. Should be pretty easy to test and I would certainly hope Walther has had a thorough look at this. But, from what I see I wouldn't put money on it or my hand in front of the muzzle while tests are being performed. M1911
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Old 05-11-2015, 09:30 PM   #17
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I just tested the possibility of firing if striker is not cocked; I put primed case in the chamber and pull the slide back just before striker cocking and let go the slide, nothing happened and almost no mark on primer. I see it as if the striker is not cached by the sear and finger is not on the trigger the striker safety should catch striker from falling anyway
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Old 05-11-2015, 09:40 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Lotsglocks View Post
I see it as if the striker is not cached by the sear and finger is not on the trigger the striker safety should catch striker from falling anyway
The striker safety drops into position in front of the striker ONLY when the striker is trapped by the sear. If you turn the pistol upside down with the slide fully to the rear you will see the striker safety behind the counter plate. When the striker engages the sear the safety must travel forward approximately 5/64th's of an inch before it drops down at the front end of the connector and just in front of the striker. If the striker is not caught by the sear it is already ahead of the safety and the safety can not prevent the firing pin from protruding through the breech face.
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Old 05-11-2015, 11:17 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Lotsglocks View Post
I put primed case in the chamber and pull the slide back just before striker cocking and let go the slide, nothing happened and almost no mark on primer.
This seems to indicate that the slow forward moving slide keeps the light striker from developing enough energy to indent a rim. Obviously if the slide is closed before the assembly is released the striker is propelled at a much greater velocity by the striker spring and with enough energy to cause reliable ignition. But, we are covering the same territory. Sooooooooo??? Who is going to keep dropping the almost cocked striker on the same round 50 times to see if we can get significant indentation or perhaps a primer to light off. That should determine if the pistol has a potential problem in one area. If the still spring loaded striker can't indent the round slamming into it by releasing the retracted slide it would seem unlikely that the nose simply pressing against the primer would set a round off just by pressing on the primer. And, it might be possible the striker does not have adequate mass to fire a round if the pistol is dropped.

But, it is still not a good design in my opinion. If parts break inside the pistol then that would be another can of worms to untangle. M1911
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Old 05-11-2015, 11:43 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Stratajema View Post
Remington had the same arguments as you in court, in front of a jury, and lost.
OK, I'd like to hear an explanation of that. What was the Model 700 problem and what did Remington argue that was similar to this potential issue with the CCP? I say potential because I haven't read where anyone has been able to achieve significant indentation or make a round fire due to a jammed firing pin or the firing pin resting against the primer in a short stroke scenario where the next round is chambered with the firing pin resting in the forward position, nose sticking out of the breech face. I'm thinking Walther would have know of this situation and have subjected the pistol to drop test while the striker was resting against the primer. Don't know, but it should seem obvious a gun manufacturer exactly how their pistol functions. The only thing I can see that would make the pistol pass this test is a striker that is simply too light to develop enough energy from a drop. M1911
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