ejection port

[maveric08]

I really like the looks of the these older walthers and I plan on starting a collection but one thing I have always wondered is why is the ejection port on the left side ?

[ZeeRaBeet]

Well, it's predecessor, the P38 had a wide open port that could easily have gone either way, but ejects to the left also. I guess for the P5 they just closed in the port to the more typical size today. Why the P38 has the ejector on the left, I don't know.

[haroldchrismeyer]

I think they may have put the ejection port on the left side for open carry concerns. If the port is on the left, it is covered by the holster when carried. This would keep out dirt.

While it looks strange, it actually works well.

[searcher451]

You have to love the looks on the faces of the people to the left of you when you are on the range and start firing the P5. That first-time "Where-did-that-come-from?" glance of surprise is always priceless.

[parabellum]

It is a vestige of the P38 design. From Orv Reichert:

"In the original design [see the 1st variation Zero series Walther guns] The very long extractor was concealed in the slide on the left side. The rear end of this extractor contained a spring loaded detent which was used to provide 'stops' for the safety lever in closed and open position.

This design was changed early on to the current style of extractor which is identical in concept to the PP-PPk style. They did not wish to change the ejector and other parts to accommodate a change in ejection to the right side so they retained the left side extractor."

When the P5 was being designed, they did not change the position of the extractor, and the P5 having a closed slide, unlike the P38, ended up with an ejection "port" on the left side.

[maveric08]

Thank you ! that was helpful information

I always like it because it was different and because I am left handed I believe that I will put it on my list *will own someday* Randall used to make a left handed 1911 that was completly left handed including a reverse barrell rifling. such desings have intrigued me.

[Shakey]

The ejection port is on the left hand side in order to payback all the shooters that keep pelting you with spent brass. As stated before the look of surprise to you left on the line is priceless!

[kearsage]

Originally Posted by Shakey

The ejection port is on the left hand side in order to payback all the shooters that keep pelting you with spent brass. As stated before the look of surprise to you left on the line is priceless!

I love that look!

[Larry]

Hello,

The explanations of Parabellum/Reichert are interesting but it doesn't say why in the first place Walther choose lefthand ejection on the P38 and on its prototypes and predecessors like MPs with internal extractors. I don't see a mecanical reason under the P38 slide cover that makes a lefthand extractor compulsory.

It's a pity that most Walther records went lost at the end of WWII. I studied the patents that are on www.p38guns.com (very good site) but, interesting as they are, they don't say anything about the reason behind the lefthand ejection.

Bye.

L.

[searcher451]

I had an opportunity to talk with Warren H. Buxton, the noted author (among others, "P.38 Pistol: The Contract Pistols, 1940-1945," Ucross Books, New Mexico) about this issue the other day while researching another matter for the forum. His response is fascinating, if you are at all interested in the lineage of the Walther line of firearms.

My question was simply this:

Dear Warren:

I’m wondering if you know why Walther decided on a left-hand ejection port for the P.38 and its continuation models through the P5. I know that the Modell 3 and the Modell 4 both had a left-hand ejection port, but the later models did not, nor did the PP and PPK series. So why switch back to the left-side system?

Sincerely,

Here's his reply:

Hello, William:

There is no definitive or verified answer to your question referencing why Walther put a left-hand ejection port in the Mod. 3. It may have been done based on a trivial aspect of the initial design process of "why not" because when the Mod. 3 was introduced, there was as yet no firm standard, implied or otherwise, as to which was better or more preferred: a left, right, or top ejection path. Since most people are right-handed, it was natural for a designer to use a right ejection path or possibly a top path; but if the designer were left-handed, he may have naturally thought in terms of a left path.

I don't know if any of the Walthers, i.e. Carl (the boss) or any of the four brothers, were left-handed. The left-hand path was transferred to the Mod. 4 simply because the same tooling and machine setup used to make the Mod. 3 was also used to manufacture the Mod. 4. The next two major tooling changes involved the Mod. 6 and Mod. 7, and both of them had the right ejection path, so the "left-handed Walther" idea falls apart with them, or so it appears.

All of the caliber 9mm Parabellum double-action Mod. MP pistols that were based on the Mod. PP platform had the right ejection path, as of course did the Mod. PP itself. However, the next radical design change after the Mod. PP-style Mod. MP pistols was the Mod. MP concealed hammer pistols. They had a left-hand ejection path because the ejector was mounted in the right side of the frame and the extractor in the left side of the breech face.

Once again, there is no known definitive or verified answer as to why the ejection path with these new designs reverted back to the left. With these guns, it was best to put the ejector on the right side of the magazine well, due to the position of the hammer drop lever in the frame and the hammer block pin, also located in the frame. But since these guns were new designs, it seems it would have been just as simple to design a right ejection path into the gun as a left. Anyway, the evolution of the concealed hammer guns then went to the Mod. AP with no major changes, once the type and style of Mod. MP was decided upon.

Another design change was made that resulted in the Mod. MP/H (as I call it), or a Mod. MP with the exposed hammer. Still, however, the left side path was retained; but by then to have changed that path would have meant a completely new design, and the funds, time, and military backing would not have allowed that. Also, as far as I know, there was never any complaint from the military or commercial customers about the left-hand ejection path, so there was no incentive for Walther to change it. The Mod. MP/H then morphed into the Mod. HP and then into the P.38.

The P5 was developed in the 1970s in response to a German police request for a new pistol, and three new designs were eventually adopted: SIG P220, H&K P7, and Walther P5. The P5 was simply a P1 redesigned to conform to the characteristics set down by the German police request-for-quotation rulings. The full length P5 slide could be made much stronger than the older P1 slide and would easily handle hot ammunition. The P1 slide, although it had been strengthened in the 1970s just for that purpose, was still considered marginal in that aspect (although it was eventually found that was of no concern) and also had the possibility of allowing the entrance of too much dirt into the pistol due to its open configuration. In addition, the P1 safety mechanism would not conform to the new RFQ rules, and an entirely new mechanism had to be designed, and it was thought that a fully enclosed slide would work better with it.

Some of the prototype P5s had the open slide like the P1, but the design quickly evolved into the closed version eventually put on the market. The P5 did gain itself an outstanding reputation for durability and reliability, even when fired with a large quantities of hot ammunition, so the factory made the correct choice there. The reason why the left-hand path was transferred from the P1 to the P5 was simply to cut design costs. As many of the original design features as possible of the P1 slide were incorporated into the new P5 slide, and that included the position and location of the extractor. The P5's frame is little changed from the P1, including the location of the ejector in the right of the magazine well, and therefore no extensive design changes were required.

The more cost-cutting the factory could do, the better, since police contracts are often non-profitable, or very close to it. The design rules for the new pistol required a magazine with about eight rounds in a single line. Walther was not too enthusiastic about this since pistols with double row magazines was what the commercial market and most other police or military markets wanted, so trying to peddle a single-row 9mm pistol was not too good an idea at that time (or now, I suppose). So, once again, whatever cost-cutting could be done was done.

So, the reason why the P5 was designed with a left ejection path is known, but that still doesn't answer the basic question of why the Mod. 3 was designed with it in the first place.

Have a nice day.

Warren Buxton

It was good of Warren to take the time. His books on the Walther line are must-haves for serious collectors and are highly recommended, especially the updated volumes. You can find them online at Ucross Books in Los Alamos, New Mexico.